The real reasons for our financial downfall

[legalbeagle 3,734]

Over the last 25 years or so, Rangers were a strong company, with continuously excellent credit ratings, etc.

For some reason people believe that football is an industry isolated from the global economic crisis, but in reality, the fact is that we were initially disadvantaged because of the fact that our owner at the time was based in an industry which heavily relied on construction. The economic crisis practically killed the private sector for construction, squeezing suppliers on price to reduce margins.

This saw the first squeeze put on us as a club, although from an outside influence.

The second impact was from the credit crunch, which led to banks feeling less able to offer a credit line, this enabled Rangers to be in a position where the debt was as low as it had been for many years, but still under threat from a bank who had nearly gone bust themselves.

The annoying thing is that our enemies spend their time accusing us of gross financial mismanagement to get into this position, they accuse us of cheating, spending outwith our means and all that stuff.

We are victims of the global economic crisis, and victims of a combination of unfortunate circumstances. So many companies in the world have had financial trouble over the last 4 years, they are not all bad, they are not all evil, they do not all deserve to be punished, why do people think that Rangers, and football in general, should be treated as separate to the real world?

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

you forgot the 3rd reason - the taigs that were put in charge at LBG.

[Bad Robot 21,152]

good post, if it wasn't for the worldwide downturn in the markets I'm also sure we wouldn't be in this predicament.

[thebooler 4,509]

you forgot the 3rd reason - the taigs that were put in charge at LBG.

And the SFA.

[sonofbear 398]

Yet Lloyds part in this all is being conveniently overshadowed and forgotten.

[A.T.G 10,773]

It was bad decision after bad decision

Murray was wreckless

Whyte was a prick

[GLASGOWRFC 101]

Fuck our previous owners construction background....Rangers are a football club so don't merge the two,,. As Murray did !

The economic crisis started in America with the big bank folding....4 years ago, but our financial fuck-ups via Murray were years before that!

Murray was guilty of

Gross financial mismanagement!

Yes.. Lots of companies have been in financial trouble over the last 4 years as you say but our problems are way before 4 years ago as I have previously said.

We are not victims of ant global economic crisis... We are victims of Murray and Whyte's fuck-up's so don't post shite!

[nachothelegend 1,932]

Yet Lloyds part in this all is being conveniently overshadowed and forgotten.

Not by me .

There is one massive common denomenator in all this hatred for us as a club and Fan Base , and I hope our Fans wake up tp it soon.

I will leave that one with you.

[GIJoe 98]

Nothing to do with global downturn, credit crunch or whatever. Murray used us for his toy and spent money like he'd got a credit card with no limit. That was unsustainable regardless of the world economic situation. Then he was "duped" into selling to a conman/criminal/lunatic who did the final nasty on us.

This needn't have happened.

[Ricky_ 893]

There is a number of reasons.

The economic crash was 1 major reason. Murrays wealth was slashed from 800m down to 100m.

the late 90's & early 00's seen us spend crazy money. £12m for flo. Advocaat spent something like £35m in his first season im sure.

it started to go downhill fast from 2002. In 2002 the SPL rejected a deal from SKY and eventually took a crap deal from BBC instead with nowhere left to go.

3 SPL clubs went into admin for it. Murray had to raise a share issue because we were in the muck.

From the McLiesh era we were in crazy debt. He was made to sign mostly free's. Our debt stood at around 80m at one point. (and trouble was brewing in the background).

Celtic were 1 horu from collapse in the 90s, so during all this time they were rebuilding in a long recovery back to balanced books.

We slashed our debt from 80m down to 18m (lloyds), but then disaster struck with HMRC's fucking bullshit bill for 10 years worth of tax we were never liable to pay anyway (the players should have at their end, but they wanted us to cover it because it was out methods) + 10 years worth of interest and penalties.

That combined with Murrays wealth plummeting & lloyds taking action to get their money back he had no option to find a buyer.

If Craig Whyte had done what he agreed to in the takeover deal we would have been fine. The takeover required the buyer to pay £18m debt off. meaning the only issue facing the club would have been the big tax case, which could have been 0 to £40m realistically.

At this point i never thought we'd come to this, i thought at worst case scenario we'd sell about half the first team to raise what we could up front and pay the rest up over a period of say, 10 years.

But it turns out Whyte was a fucking scam artist and instead of paying the debt like his deal stated, he simply created more debt to the tune of £27m. And didnt bother paying £9m in tax to furtehr add to our liabilites to the tax man, both in guarenteed debt & potential debt (TBTC). Thats when the figures of money owed started getting insane, potentially £134m etc....

there isn;t a single biggest reason. its a combination of alot of things. The big tax case was a crippling body blow, taht we could have recovered from, but Craig Whyte was the knock out blow. I hope he spends a long time in jail for what he done to us & scottish football on the whole. I hope when the other SPL clubs start paying off cleaners & receptionists to cope with the shortfall caused by our absence, they remember Craig Whytes illegal & fraudelent takeover.

[Non_Sucumbi 876]

It was bad decision after bad decision

Murray was wreckless

Whyte was a prick

Disagree strongly with point 2.

Fans are reckless. We are reckless sometimes in what we write, post or sing. We are reckless in our unbridled devotion to a club we love. Reckless in spending to follow our great club.

Murray conversely was calculating conniving and manipulative particularly in the matter of LLoyds. He calculated the monies owed to LLoyds, he connived to sell RFC to pay off the LLoyds debt and manipulated a deal with a known crook.

All this he did for the benefit of MIH (his company) who by coincidence secured an almost 200M pound loan from Lloyds after the RFC deal was done.

Murray == reckless -- I think not.

[Sobatai 70]

It all comes down to Wim Jansen and that elusive tenth in a row ... it was the first setback in the Murray era and he didn't take it at all well. Ego bruised, he appointed Dick Advocaat and started spending stupid money on mediocre players.

[knowledge 21]

Yet Lloyds part in this all is being conveniently overshadowed and forgotten.

This should never be forgotten.

[Bluepeter9 5,167]

Over the last 25 years or so, Rangers were a strong company, with continuously excellent credit ratings, etc.

For some reason people believe that football is an industry isolated from the global economic crisis, but in reality, the fact is that we were initially disadvantaged because of the fact that our owner at the time was based in an industry which heavily relied on construction. The economic crisis practically killed the private sector for construction, squeezing suppliers on price to reduce margins.

This saw the first squeeze put on us as a club, although from an outside influence.

The second impact was from the credit crunch, which led to banks feeling less able to offer a credit line, this enabled Rangers to be in a position where the debt was as low as it had been for many years, but still under threat from a bank who had nearly gone bust themselves.

The annoying thing is that our enemies spend their time accusing us of gross financial mismanagement to get into this position, they accuse us of cheating, spending outwith our means and all that stuff.

We are victims of the global economic crisis, and victims of a combination of unfortunate circumstances. So many companies in the world have had financial trouble over the last 4 years, they are not all bad, they are not all evil, they do not all deserve to be punished, why do people think that Rangers, and football in general, should be treated as separate to the real world?

the recession did not do side letter contracts nor cause us to fail to pay the PAYE nor did it force us to overspend and although unproven the ressesion did not set up the EBT scheme.

the rrcession caught an over extended company out and the other stuff then came tumbling into play. we can look for excuses but we also need to temper that with a dose of reality

[Chesh 28]

I am on my phone so cant quote but the person saying the exonomic crisis started with the American bank folding is wrong. Is started vefore that.

We think lending in this country has been wreckless the lending on mortgages particulary in America was suicidal! We have seen nothing here in comparison to the amount of repossesions there was in America

Sorry slightly off topic

[Weird_Beard 99]

The annoying thing is that our enemies spend their time accusing us of gross financial mismanagement to get into this position,

I must be the enemy then.

[gersandy 594]

Murray shouldered us with his metals company. Said company took a 65% drop in value when the markets crashed. Our credit line disappeared. Leaving us with a black hole.

[jonbryce 63]

1340320239' post='1060141623']

Over the last 25 years or so, Rangers were a strong company, with continuously excellent credit ratings, etc.

For some reason people believe that football is an industry isolated from the global economic crisis, but in reality, the fact is that we were initially disadvantaged because of the fact that our owner at the time was based in an industry which heavily relied on construction. The economic crisis practically killed the private sector for construction, squeezing suppliers on price to reduce margins.

This saw the first squeeze put on us as a club, although from an outside influence.

The second impact was from the credit crunch, which led to banks feeling less able to offer a credit line, this enabled Rangers to be in a position where the debt was as low as it had been for many years, but still under threat from a bank who had nearly gone bust themselves.

The annoying thing is that our enemies spend their time accusing us of gross financial mismanagement to get into this position, they accuse us of cheating, spending outwith our means and all that stuff.

We are victims of the global economic crisis, and victims of a combination of unfortunate circumstances. So many companies in the world have had financial trouble over the last 4 years, they are not all bad, they are not all evil, they do not all deserve to be punished, why do people think that Rangers, and football in general, should be treated as separate to the real world?

It was reckless lending like the sort of lending the Bank of Scotland made to Murray that caused the financial crisis in the first place. That meant that Lloyds was forced to take over BoS, and start calling in these sorts of loans.

There is a huge demand for metal in China and prices are at an all time high, so much so that a steel mill in Middlesborough was recently reopened to help meet demand. Also, car manufacturing is doing extremely well in this country at the moment, and that requires quite a bit of metal.

It is Murray's property deals that caused him problems, not the metal trading which should be doing better than ever.

[choochooblue 342]

The only effect the economic downfall had on murray was preventing him putting us £150/200 million in debt .

[debear 603]

So the financial downturn 4 years ago was the reason for us being run poorly beforehand?

[Misteral 2,932]

The reasons we are in todays mess are manym and things kept piling up from Murray's EBTs , through RBS, LLoyds, weak Directors, the global financial crisis and HMRC. But at the end of the day it was Whyte who was the final catalyst in a long line of catalysts of those closely connected with the running of our club. Fuckin moron.

Then the Scottish Media, SPL, SFA, and other Scottish football clubs decided to jump on us when we were at our weakest. More fuckin morons.

I'm really thinking that withdrawing our application to the SPL at 23.59 on July the 3rd is a great idea to fuck them over but at the same time it feels like it might be biting of our nose off to spite our face.

But I'm so angry and I want a fight. Hope hope Mr. Green wants one too. He would definitely have quite a few folk backing him up. But at the end of the day I am realistic enough to know that income streams are a bit more important than pride at the moment.