Boab 73 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Was just about to go to bed when I seen this story in the paper on the radiator: TWO Rangers fans have been banned for life from Ibrox over reports of sectarian singing at a Subway station. George Sawden, 35, and Alan Lochore, 26, were arrested by British Transport Police just before kick-off at last month's SPL clash with Aberdeen. Sawden was fined £200 at Glasgow Sheriff Court after the fan, from Dumfries, admitted a sectarian-related breach of the peace charge. advertisement Lochore, from Renfrew, pleaded not guilty to the same charge and is awaiting trial. But the pair have now been banned "indefinitely" from matches at Ibrox. It's understood both were held in connection with two separate incidents on the Subway on November 22. A Rangers spokeswoman said: "We can confirm two people arrested on the day of the Rangers v Aberdeen match at Ibrox underground station have been banned from the ground." The arrests follow a widely publicised crackdown on fans travelling on the Subway. In July, two Rangers supporters were caught singing bigoted songs before the Champions League qualifier with Lithuanian side FC Kaunas. The men, both understood to be season ticket-holders, were reported to Rangers, with BTP seeking banning orders. Transport cops use mini-cameras and audio recorders to monitor crowd behaviour on match days. Senior officials have also warned that plain-clothes officers may also be used to gather evidence. Rangers security officials have agreed to share information with BTP as part of a new code of practice. It was revealed last month Rangers fans involved in anti-social behaviour or disorder on the rail network or Subway would face football banning orders or have their season tickets confiscated. Publication date 11/12/08 http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/news/display...2474470.0.0.php Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimjim1690 4,534 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 When did Rangers become a facist organisation. what happened to innocent till proven guilty Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOLUWDC 1 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Transport cops use mini-cameras and audio recorders to monitor crowd behaviour on match days. Senior officials have also warned that plain-clothes officers may also be used to gather evidence. Is there any need for this ? Seriously ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvager 498 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Seems fantastically extreme. Do any other clubs do this to their supporters? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreckedroy 33 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 When did Rangers become a facist organisation. what happened to innocent till proven guilty From the report I'd say it's probable that Rangers security officials have already seen the BTP videos of the incidents. Sawden pled guilty so he was certain to be banned, and I don't think Lochore would be banned yet unless Rangers thought there was proof of his guilt. Big Brother is most definitely watching! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MosesMcNeil 1,664 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Transport cops use mini-cameras and audio recorders to monitor crowd behaviour on match days. Senior officials have also warned that plain-clothes officers may also be used to gather evidence. Is there any need for this ? Seriously ? Orwellian. Our every move is monitored. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShootSpeedKillLight 0 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Ridiculous. I don't even know where to begin with what's wrong with that. Banned from a stadium for singing songs in a train station? If so I should probably be banned as well, I was on the underground that day and singing a few songs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brissybear 50 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Ridiculous. I don't even know where to begin with what's wrong with that. Banned from a stadium for singing songs in a train station? If so I should probably be banned as well, I was on the underground that day and singing a few songs. I do feel being banned from Ibrox is way too extreme. However, there is no excuse for PUBLICLY singing bigoted offensive songs. If anything they are more offensive to ordinary folk going about thier daily business. Its simple, stop singinging bigoted offensive songs. However #2, just what is deemed sectarian and offensive? As long as traditional cultural songs like DW's and the Sash are deemed non sectarian, which they arent, then alls well. If it stops buckied up neds spouting garbage over women and kids on trains and buses, so be it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaffbear 4,096 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 What has singing on the subway got to do with Rangers Who the fuck do they think they are!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CooperSF 5,792 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 I would love them to get the number 9 bus from Linwood to Ibrox The banning orders dept. would have a field day Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaffbear 4,096 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Christ i used to get the 9 from Drumchapel to Ibrox and if anyone had came on and said stop that sectarian singing they would have found themselves under the wheels of the bus behind...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelle1880 225 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 Absolutely disgraceful. Maybe they could try and handle real crime, wankers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BallochBear 1,613 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 What has singing on the subway got to do with Rangers Who the fuck do they think they are!!! While the singing of some songs may be offensive when women and children are around, just what has it to do with Rangers, and how can they ban people for something done on the Subway, ffs they could have been at Cowcaddens, hardly adjacent to Ibrox is it? Where does it all stop, I once sang TBB at a party in my house your honour, will I get banned too. Does this attitude not open the floodgates for every Shettleston harrier to masquerade as a bear, sing sectarian songs and bring more disgrace on our club? :cobblers: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBlue 136 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 What has singing on the subway got to do with Rangers Who the fuck do they think they are!!! While the singing of some songs may be offensive when women and children are around, just what has it to do with Rangers, and how can they ban people for something done on the Subway, ffs they could have been at Cowcaddens, hardly adjacent to Ibrox is it? Where does it all stop, I once sang TBB at a party in my house your honour, will I get banned too. Does this attitude not open the floodgates for every Shettleston harrier to masquerade as a bear, sing sectarian songs and bring more disgrace on our club? :cobblers: But they weren't in their house. Two season ticket holders on match day it says in the report. So I think we can assume that they were travelling to the match, rather than Christmas shopping. In which case it has everything to do with Rangers as the actions of supporters travelling to matches very much reflects on the club's image. It's been made clear the this sort of behaviour isn't going to be tolerated so the outcome isn't exactly a surprise One of those involved pled guilty. In the other's case there is an argument that the issue shouldn't be prejudged before the court case. OTOH there are many situations where a person will be suspended from an activity if they have been charged with a criminal offence relating to it. If he is acquitted then clearly the club should remove the banning order and if it didn't that would be a cause for concern. If supporters think they have a right to sing offensive songs in enclosed spaces like an underground station where there may be women and children about, then they shouldn't complain when they find out that's not the case. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
papaguy51 912 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 That really is ridiculous. How can you possibly defend that MikeBlue? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannan 0 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 good get em to fuck, its the kinda behaviour i have seen and made me think its the kinda impression i wouldnt want kids to see and think that this is what supporting rangers is all about Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
papaguy51 912 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 good get em to fuck, its the kinda behaviour i have seen and made me think its the kinda impression i wouldnt want kids to see and think that this is what supporting rangers is all about Maybe I'm missing something, but do you even know what they were singing? As we've seen a thousand and one times, our definition of bigotry is often different to others. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WVB 2,560 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 good get em to fuck, its the kinda behaviour i have seen and made me think its the kinda impression i wouldnt want kids to see and think that this is what supporting rangers is all about Ok then gobby...... I'm off out in my van. Rangers scarf, as ever, in the front window. I'll be playing TBB, TFIO, Here Lies A Soldier etc rather loudly as i drive. I may even sing along. I shall glare at any hoop wearing bassa & laugh at their reaction (usually 2 fingers or suchlike). Get used to it. We are not going away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leiper 0 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 If Rangers are banning fans from Ibrox for singing offensive, sectarian songs...Will they also be banning people with other, more serious, convictions? Just another example of our Club do as they are told instead of doing as they should. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff crap in the head 120 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 good get em to fuck, its the kinda behaviour i have seen and made me think its the kinda impression i wouldnt want kids to see and think that this is what supporting rangers is all about Ok then gobby...... I'm off out in my van. Rangers scarf, as ever, in the front window. I'll be playing TBB, TFIO, Here Lies A Soldier etc rather loudly as i drive. I may even sing along. I shall glare at any hoop wearing bassa & laugh at their reaction (usually 2 fingers or suchlike). Get used to it. We are not going away. Well put Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab 73 Posted December 12, 2008 Author Share Posted December 12, 2008 If Rangers are banning fans from Ibrox for singing offensive, sectarian songs...Will they also be banning people with other, more serious, convictions? Just another example of our Club do as they are told instead of doing as they should. Going through Disclosure Scotland as one puts in their Season Ticket Renewal Forms Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poetry_In_Blue 1,043 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 IF a member has suspicions that another member is a Timposter then send a PM to admin/mods with their details and why you think they are timposters, DO NOT do it on an open forum, any allegations are investigated as much as is humanly possible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poetry_In_Blue 1,043 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 After the incidents at the UEFA Cup final, UEFA made it clear that any incident that happened outside the ground were a civil matter and that UEFA could not take action against the club. As far as I'm concerned irrespective of this being a match day incident, it occurred outside of the ground, therefore it is purely a civil matter between the police and those that were charged. The incident did not occur within Ibrox therefore Rangers should not have given life bans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnGalbraith 0 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 I bet the most gaulling part is, the songs were probably the likes of Derrys Walls and The Sash i.e not sectarian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BallochBear 1,613 Posted December 12, 2008 Share Posted December 12, 2008 What has singing on the subway got to do with Rangers Who the fuck do they think they are!!! While the singing of some songs may be offensive when women and children are around, just what has it to do with Rangers, and how can they ban people for something done on the Subway, ffs they could have been at Cowcaddens, hardly adjacent to Ibrox is it? Where does it all stop, I once sang TBB at a party in my house your honour, will I get banned too. Does this attitude not open the floodgates for every Shettleston harrier to masquerade as a bear, sing sectarian songs and bring more disgrace on our club? :cobblers: But they weren't in their house. Two season ticket holders on match day it says in the report. So I think we can assume that they were travelling to the match, rather than Christmas shopping. In which case it has everything to do with Rangers as the actions of supporters travelling to matches very much reflects on the club's image. It's been made clear the this sort of behaviour isn't going to be tolerated so the outcome isn't exactly a surprise One of those involved pled guilty. In the other's case there is an argument that the issue shouldn't be prejudged before the court case. OTOH there are many situations where a person will be suspended from an activity if they have been charged with a criminal offence relating to it. If he is acquitted then clearly the club should remove the banning order and if it didn't that would be a cause for concern. If supporters think they have a right to sing offensive songs in enclosed spaces like an underground station where there may be women and children about, then they shouldn't complain when they find out that's not the case. You are assuming they were travelling to the match, and while they probably were, and I know one of them admitted to the offence, but my point is how can Rangers ban fans who are outwith their control/stadium or surrounds thereof. It is making this a bloody police state, and where does it end, does it mean somone caught singing a "banned" song anywhere on the planet can be banned from Ibrox? While I don't agree with many of the songs and they shouldn't be sung at a match in the stadium, and indeed IMO is they shouldn't be sung at all, I do defend an individuals right to sing them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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