Saturday, the manager and the season ahead

[K.A.I 36,183]

1 minute ago, Turnberry18 said:

Rangers is a totally different club, and nothing suggests that McInnes would bring success here.

I don't know how you can say that.

But OK.

and what has Pedro done that suggests to you he'll be a success here, then? or are you not making a case for him staying, just a case of you don't want McInnes as his replacement? 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

17 minutes ago, KWBear said:

Yes if a manager is underperforming or is not fit for purpose he should be replaced

it is the board's responsibility to find the funds to entice a proven manager of quality to manage us. Simply saying that they don't have the ability to do so then renders the entire hierarchy not fit for purpose and questions need to be asked. 

Simply sticking by Pedro because he's in charge whilst ignoring all the on-field issues is bizarre. So if we are sitting in 10th place with a goal difference of -50 come February you'd still give him til the end of the season? 

Mental 

Middle paragraph is getting to the heart of the problem. 

[KWBear 1,640]

1 minute ago, Turnberry18 said:

Ordinarily I would agree with you, but sacking him and replacing him with managers of a similar standard is a no go for me; I just wouldn't go there. I know who I would pick, and have said it on here numerous times; but he would require a salary, and a budget that would make us compete for the title. Anything other than that is just us moving deckchairs around.

Who would you pick? 

I struggle to believe that there is nobody out there in the entire world that doesn't represent an upgrade on caixinha. Who is performing well in the leagues around Ukraine, Brazil, Argentina, Sweden or Denmark? I don't have a clue, and as mentioned that is the role of the DoF who is paid a princely sum to answer such questions. 

Just because we don't see a manager out of work who we are all familiar with doesn't mean there isn't one out there. Similarly there's nothing to suggest that said manager has to be out of work. We were apparently willing to part with 600 grand to tempt caixinha to Rangers before his contract expired so the club needs to find the readies in order to get the right man in 

refuse to accept mediocrity "just because". If we continue to get fucked on the field then he needs to go. Continuity just for the sake of it when we are underperforming is nonsense. Huge clubs around Europe, former "giants" have slipped into obscurity. Massive massive clubs have fallen and we are no different. It's happening to us now and we are at risk of becoming a total fucking irrelevance.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

Just now, Gustav said:

What suggests to you that Pedro will bring us success?

Not a thing. But that isn't the point of my argument. We would need an better alternative. Surely that's the only reason you would sack him and bring someone else in.

[The Specky Forum Organiser 64,712]

Just now, Turnberry18 said:

Not a thing. But that isn't the point of my argument. We would need an better alternative. Surely that's the only reason you would sack him and bring someone else in.

You sack him because he isn't good at his job and he is guaranteeing us failure.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

Just now, KWBear said:

Who would you pick? 

I struggle to believe that there is nobody out there in the entire world that doesn't represent an upgrade on caixinha. Who is performing well in the leagues around Ukraine, Brazil, Argentina, Sweden or Denmark? I don't have a clue, and as mentioned that is the role of the DoF who is paid a princely sum to answer such questions. 

Just because we don't see a manager out of work who we are all familiar with doesn't mean there isn't one out there. Similarly there's nothing to suggest that said manager has to be out of work. We were apparently willing to part with 600 grand to tempt caixinha to Rangers before his contract expired so the club needs to find the readies in order to get the right man in 

refuse to accept mediocrity "just because". If we continue to get fucked on the field then he needs to go. Continuity just for the sake of it when we are underperforming is nonsense. Huge clubs around Europe, former "giants" have slipped into obscurity. Massive massive clubs have fallen and we are no different. It's happening to us now and we are at risk of becoming a total fucking irrelevance.

Mark Hughes. It wouldn't happen, he would need a budget, he wouldn't come cheap, so it doesn't really matter. But, ideally, I would have him here. I like his mentality, and I think he would be perfect for this club, in an ideal situation.

[Turnberry18 3,204]

Just now, Gustav said:

You sack him because he isn't good at his job and he is guaranteeing us failure.

I don't see it guaranteed, but the alternatives are not obvious.

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

McInnes took Aberdeen to third in his first full season as Aberdeen manager...despite having significantly greater resources than second placed Motherwell.  Was Stuart McCall a vastly superior manager to McInnes?  

 

 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

He gets the season so yes. 

If we are in second you going to give him the season?

Ive said from the start he gets the season, he has to finish second and he has close the gap to the scum, if not he deserves to be replaced. 

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

3 minutes ago, Gustav said:

If we are 4th in December, 25 points off the filth, 10 off Aberdeen would you keep him?

The above was meant for you mate. ?

[KWBear 1,640]

Question to all posters 

why does it automatically have to be mcinnes? 

Isnt this what our DoF is here to do? Oversee managerial appointments and football strategy? 

If Pedro goes it doesn't automatically mean that mcinnes is a guarantee. Fucking lazy argument to make - back Pedro cos the alternative is mcinnes and fuck mcinnes because he's mcinnes. 

[The Specky Forum Organiser 64,712]

1 minute ago, Courtyard Bear said:

He gets the season so yes. 

If we are in second you going to give him the season?

Ive said from the start he gets the season, he has to finish second and he has close the gap to the scum, if not he deserves to be replaced. 

I wouldn't give him tomorrow's game never mind the season.

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

1 minute ago, Gustav said:

I wouldn't give him tomorrow's game never mind the season.

We will have to agree to disagree. 

[ForeverAndEver 71,493]

2 minutes ago, coopsleftboot said:

McInnes took Aberdeen to third in his first full season as Aberdeen manager...despite having significantly greater resources than second placed Motherwell.  Was Stuart McCall a vastly superior manager to McInnes?  

 

 

He took a team from 8th to 3rd, 2 points behind second which Motherwell got with a last minute winner against them, and won them their first trophy in 19 years.

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, Courtyard Bear said:

So where do you stop? Just get shot, get shot, get shot. 

What kind of manager do you seriously think is going to take a job at a club like that? 

Also can you tell me where we are going to find the money to sack 3 managers a season on the off chance we get lucky and find a good one that manages to win his first 8 games. 

Yes you just keep getting shot until you find the right person. 

Any manager confident in his own abilities wouldn't have any issues with it.

There's more to it than getting a manager on the off chance and getting lucky - you are getting more and more ridiculous in your justifications for keeping hold of Pedro mate. Appointing a manager isn't just shutting your eyes and picking names out a hat hoping one of them get's it right.

The money aspect, well that's unfortunate - but there's no way Rangers can't afford not to find 700/800k grand and pay of someone who's hopeless. In fact it's not even that much in the grand scheme of things really as we both know it wouldn't be 3 managers a season ... a season only lasts about 9-months so we won't be turning over a permanent manager every 3-months.

[KWBear 1,640]

Apparently mcinnes is the only manager in the world that could possibly succeed our current manager. 

 

[K.A.I 36,183]

9 minutes ago, coopsleftboot said:

McInnes took Aberdeen to third in his first full season as Aberdeen manager...despite having significantly greater resources than second placed Motherwell.  Was Stuart McCall a vastly superior manager to McInnes?  

 

 

Define the greater resources to Motherwell ... they probably have a couple of thousand more season ticket holders or something but significantly greater resources is an exagerration on your part.

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

2 minutes ago, ForeverAndEver said:

He took a team from 8th to 3rd, 2 points behind second which Motherwell got with a last minute winner against them, and won them their first trophy in 19 years.

Still took him over a season and a half to do it.  Funnily enough, he took over the Aberdeen team at the same stage of the season as Pedro did...

Start of their first full seasons, McInnes had only won 2 of 5 league games, Pedro won 3 of 5.  Aberdeen were on 7 points, Rangers were on 10.

Does that make McInnes better than Pedro at the same stages of their tenures?   Aberdeen had no competition other than celtic... Rangers have a stronger celtic and a stable Aberdeen (who've trusted a manager and given him time).

 

 

[Virtuoso 27,180]

19 hours ago, Rfc52 said:

Saturday is now only game number 7 into the season and we have the real possibility of going 8 points behind. I know Tuesday's league cup game comes first 

A failure to win tomorrow and Pedro shouldn't in charge come Saturday.

He should have the  decency to resign first thing Wednesday morning.

[The Specky Forum Organiser 64,712]

1 minute ago, coopsleftboot said:

Still took him over a season and a half to do it.  Funnily enough, he took over the Aberdeen team at the same stage of the season as Pedro did...

Start of their first full seasons, McInnes had only won 2 of 5 league games, Pedro won 3 of 5.  Aberdeen were on 7 points, Rangers were on 10.

Does that make McInnes better than Pedro at the same stages of their tenures?   Aberdeen had no competition other than celtic... Rangers have a stronger celtic and a stable Aberdeen (who've trusted a manager and given him time).

 

 

Do you think Pedro will be a success for us?

[Turnberry18 3,204]

5 minutes ago, KWBear said:

Apparently mcinnes is the only manager in the world that could possibly succeed our current manager. 

 

If football today teaches us anything, it tells us that you only get the manager your board deserve.  Unless things change in terms of the budget etc then what happens with the manager is maybe not completely irrelevant, but largely so.

[Courtyard Bear 41,357]

Just now, K.A.I said:

Yes you just keep getting shot until you find the right person. 

Any manager confident in his own abilities wouldn't have any issues with it.

There's more to it than getting a manager on the off chance and getting lucky - you are getting more and more ridiculous in your justifications for keeping hold of Pedro mate. Appointing a manager isn't just shutting your eyes and picking names out a hat hoping one of them get's it right.

The money aspect, well that's unfortunate - but there's no way Rangers can't afford not to find 700/800k grand and pay of someone who's hopeless. In fact it's not even that much in the grand scheme of things really as we both know it wouldn't be 3 managers a season ... a season only lasts about 9-months so we won't be turning over a permanent manager every 3-months.

Why would we not? if he didn't win his first 8 games he would be get slaughtered and calls for his head would start. As for the confident in his own abilities, show me a manager that isn't confident in his own abilities. The guy we have at the moment exudes confidence in his own abilities and is probably why he got the job. 

Any manager coming to a club that has a history of sacking quickly isn't going to come on a 1 year deal. They will be looking for at least 2/3 years, you want to tell me where our board are going to find that kind of money from to sack them at the drop of a hat  

If I had any confidence in our board finding a gem of a manager maybe I could see your argument. I have no confidence in this board. 

We are going round in circles here mate, Ive said from the off he gets the season if he hasn't improved our position in the league (finishing at least second and closing the gap to the scum) then he should be replaced. Rangers has been here for 145 years and will be here for a lot longer after I'm gone. The least the club should do is give any manager they choose 1 season. 

[ForeverAndEver 71,493]

8 minutes ago, coopsleftboot said:

Still took him over a season and a half to do it.  Funnily enough, he took over the Aberdeen team at the same stage of the season as Pedro did...

Start of their first full seasons, McInnes had only won 2 of 5 league games, Pedro won 3 of 5.  Aberdeen were on 7 points, Rangers were on 10.

Does that make McInnes better than Pedro at the same stages of their tenures?   Aberdeen had no competition other than celtic... Rangers have a stronger celtic and a stable Aberdeen (who've trusted a manager and given him time).

 

 

Aberdeen had finished 9th the 3 season before he took charge, so it's obvious they were fucking shite. So for a team that had finished as high as eighth in McInnes' first season, it's not too bad. We were third and then spent more than everybody but celtic, beat Motherwell, beat by a newly promoted team, and drew with Hearts.

[coopsleftboot 5,512]

Just now, Gustav said:

Do you think Pedro will be a success for us?

I think we'll be second if he's allowed to see the season out.  To go better than that we need serious investment (not his issue).

We're clearly a better team than last season, and will improve further...imo.

The two games against Thistle we won last year were fortunate and papered over inadequacies.  Fridays game, apart from 15 minutes in the second half, we virtually camped in their half, 17 shots to 3 in our favour with 10 of them on target.  

All we did last season was "look after the ball".  This season we're actually making chances, scored 13 goals in 6 games...not enough in my opinion, but better than last year.  It took us 12 games to reach 13 goals last season.  Twice the improvement.

Defensively, still could do with tightening up, we've conceded 8 in the first 5 games, against 11 in the first 5 last season - take the celtic game out of that from last year and its about the same.

Points wise, we have 11 after 6 games.  Last season we had 6 after 6 games.  Improvement there.

I see better players on the pitch who appear to have a greater hunger for the game than last years lot.  I see more aggression.  

So yes, I see Pedro being a success if that means taking us forward into a better place than last season.   The signs are there and if allowed the space to do so, we'll get better.  I'd love to say I think we can challenge for the league, but that would be supremely optimistic and would rely on heavy investment and a bit of luck.  

 

[Brown Brogues 223]

Who is to say that McInnes would even want to come? We are a big club i get that, but we are a tough gig at the moment. At aberdeen he has assembled a decent squad, and is probably on decent money after the sunderland interest. We snubbed him last time remember.

The pressure of being the Rangers manager at this present time is not to be underestimated.