trublusince1982 768 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 If our income already outstrips our expenses(which it 100% doesn't by the way) why would we need Kings investment. ?things like the buying of ed house and other investments are not part of our yearly expenses. Our yearly expenses (bills) came to £18m last year with our income at £19m. The debt is made up of one off costs which the papers then decided to just divide by 12 to give a monthly cost and make it sound worse. The investment the board are looking for is to help fund future development not to keep the club open. Our income of £19m did not include a full years sponsorship money and also didn't include merchandise money for a full year as the deals were late. The accounts covering this season with be around £19m expenses and income of around £21- £23m. But we will still have cash costs to cover from the ipo and purchasing of ed house and carpark wifi etc that will not be reoccurring costs. We also need to find cash for a transfer kitty plus slush funds to be able to invest in scouting plus the development of ed house and further investment ideas the board want to persue on behalf of the club. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassaaaa 11,406 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 What a stupid question. Of course I don't. I don't need a full breakdown though. As things stand today I can 100% guarantee you our income does not outstrip our expenses.Why not phone graham Wallace and tell him he is talking utter shite about reducing expenses cause 2 mentalists on the internet believe we are now in profit.Sheer lunacy. As i thought , you posted a bullshit remark straight from your own head once again .......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEPPS BOY 74,685 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Funny how MCmade-up-name was saying the same yesterday..Obviously the same rat telling him his info.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 things like the buying of ed house and other investments are not part of our yearly expenses. Our yearly expenses (bills) came to £18m last year with our income at £19m. The debt is made up of one off costs which the papers then decided to just divide by 12 to give a monthly cost and make it sound worse. The investment the board are looking for is to help fund future development not to keep the club open. Our income of £19m did not include a full years sponsorship money and also didn't include merchandise money for a full year as the deals were late. The accounts covering this season with be around £19m expenses and income of around £21- £23m. But we will still have cash costs to cover from the ipo and purchasing of ed house and carpark wifi etc that will not be reoccurring costs. We also need to find cash for a transfer kitty plus slush funds to be able to invest in scouting plus the development of ed house and further investment ideas the board want to persue on behalf of the club.Good lord.Our yearly expenses were NOT £18m last year. That was JUST our staff bill FFS. Our yearly operational costs were £33m. I can 100% assure you our income does not outstrip our expenses. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 As i thought , you posted a bullshit remark straight from your own head once again ..........Take your heid out of the sand ffs.Can you show me how we have turned a £14m loss into a profit in the space of 7 months ? If you can do so, can we then start up a business together please. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
willygers4life 1,031 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 And in all of this it's only Dave king that would save the club, who is to say the current investors would be willing to lose their percentage holding. Seems to me like a non story cause lee Wallace wasn't sold really think if we was going to be broke that he would still be here really, also what fan or supporter would be hoping this is true for big man Dave king to come in. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 By the way, the purchase of Edmiston House and Albion Car Park come out of cashflow. On the Profit and Loss accounts, the £2.5m spent on them will be depreciated over many, many years at something like £100k per year. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassaaaa 11,406 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Take your heid out of the sand ffs.Can you show me how we have turned a £14m loss into a profit in the space of 7 months ? If you can do so, can we then start up a business together please. You posted a comment on here once again with fuck all facts to back it up .You and anyone else don't know all the financial details of the club so why post stuff that is speculation at best .Owned and ran several succesful businesses over the years , you are the last cunt i need any advice from .......... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 You posted a comment on here once again with fuck all facts to back it up .You and anyone else don't know all the financial details of the club so why post stuff that is speculation at best .Owned and ran several succesful businesses over the years , you are the last cunt i need any advice from ..........Here are some facts with some subsequent workings/assumptions all of which were roundly accepted as being more realistic a few weeks ago:Firstly, may i start off by saying this isnt easy when you dont have a full P&L spreadsheet to look at where you can look at each and every line and nothing below should be taken as gospel. Would be good to get Boss's interpretation as well on it given his financial background.The £1m per month losses is raised a lot and it has came back in favour over the last few days. Many people point out the "one off expenses" and some point out that our losses last year EXCLUDED "one off expenses" which is correct.........to a point.In summary, for a 13 month period our income was £19.1m and our Expenditure was £33.7m. The expenditure figure excluded the following:Footballing debt £2.7mIPO expenses £0.3m (I will revisit this)Whyte Investigation £0.6mAcquisition expenses £0.6mThis means that the £4.2m above was OVER and ABOVE the £33.7m and therefore cannot be considered/deducted when estimating future expenditure.So can we get a normalised 12 month figure for going forward ?Firstly, its my view that our £19.1m of income was NOT a true 13 month figure. The bottom line is that in the extra month we would not have been raising any income due to the administration process and the purchase of the assets. In addition to that, some of the sponsorship and merchandise deals were not agreed until a future date in the financial year which would actually result in a very slight increase in income. At a guess, i believe our true income for this year will be around £20m.The £33.7m of costs however, are nearer a true 13 months than income. Players/staff/operation costs/PAYE etc all still needed to be paid and there is very few items listed in the expenditure that you could discount from the true calculation in my opinion. This means on a very crude basis, our actual expenditure for a 12 month period last season was £31.1m.So what can be taken out of last season that will not recur.We were told at the AGM we incurred £2.5m of IPO consultancy costs. These were clearly in addition to the non recurring IPO expenses separated from operating expenditure above.We know that Stockbridge handed back(thats right Bawsburst, he confirmed it at the AGM) £200kOur Directors remuneration has dropped from £1.7m to £0.7m (though there will be a little bit of a hangover on Mathers until next years accounts)We have got rid of Ahmad on £300kOur manager has accepted a £375k reduction in salary(again some hangover until next season)We paid £1.7m to terminate pre admin contracts of players/agents.From the above list, i make it £6.4m of costs in the 2012/2013 accounts are now off our "monthly expenditure" list. I have not included things like the purchase of Albion and Edmiston as typically, these would be capitalised over 25 years or something. These purchases impacted cashflow, but will not impact ongoing expenditure. I have also left out the rumoured £1m drop in wages this season for the players(prior to the 15% talks) as i have no decent source on that.This means a truer figure of our annual expenditure is nearer £24.7m now just from the list above although im sure there are other things.So as things stand, £20m income and £24.7m expenditure effectively meaning we are now losing £400k per month, NOT £1m.£4.7m gap could be swallowed up by:£1m reduction in salaries already rumoured.£0.4m from Durrant and McDowall£1m if all footballing players agreed 15% reduction until back in Top division£1.4m if season books increase by 20%£1m by asking Smith, Foster, Simonsen, Cribari and Jig to find a new club.Again, i reiterate this shouldnt be taken as gospel and im sure there are loads of things i have missed out or forgotten so happy to take any suggestions on board and adapt as we go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian 4,281 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 You posted a comment on here once again with fuck all facts to back it up .You and anyone else don't know all the financial details of the club so why post stuff that is speculation at best .Owned and ran several succesful businesses over the years , you are the last cunt i need any advice from ..........more abuse and vitriol, yet no rebuttal of Lawmans points.Sound like you don't run businesses now. Probably just as well.What were they ? Enron ? Comet ? Woolworths ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Before anyone misinterprets, what im saying is not back up to the story as it sounds a load of pish to me. But lets not deny we are still making a loss, hence the 120 day review, bringing in Nash, talking about salary reductions etc.If we were in profit, there would be no need for such nonsense as we would be primed for a second wave of investment ffs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 more abuse and vitriol, yet no rebuttal of Lawmans points.Sound like you don't run businesses now. Probably just as well.What were they ? Enron ? Comet ? Woolworths ?I really find it difficult to believe that anyone in our support would actually think we were making a profit right now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bheast Skelper 411 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 You posted a comment on here once again with fuck all facts to back it up .You and anyone else don't know all the financial details of the club so why post stuff that is speculation at best .Owned and ran several succesful businesses over the years , you are the last cunt i need any advice from ..........FFS Show a bit of faith in the board and give them and the club your support and stop being so quick to dive in and believe the shite thats put out in the rhags.They have proved many times that they would like to report on our death Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
piperpete 3,186 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 We will just have to sit tight and wait and see, if the story is wrong the Club need to be taking ThecSun all the way and take millions of them for the damage they have caused both our share price and our name.I would like to think We would be giving a strong statement re buffing thisattack on us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcb 1,167 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I really find it difficult to believe that anyone in our support would actually think we were making a profit right now. Aye but they're out there.Not a shred of evidence to back them up but what does that matter.?Truly frightening. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I really find it difficult to believe that anyone in our support would actually think we were making a profit right now. do you believe the £14m loss included the purchase price? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArchibaldLeitch 380 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Stockbridge did not forecast we would run out money at any time.It seems odd we didn't sell Wallace if we were that skint. So on that bombshell, this story is bollocks.Poor old True blue still clinging to dreams of DK riding to the rescue. Even 20 million off him would only buy us some time. After a year at mout we wouled be right back where we are now.That is not the answer.We have a good effective board with Rangers best interests at heart, who will steady the ship, get us running within our means and then attract the investment that will be the foundation for our future.No more boom and bust with sugar daddies. Brian stockbridge's exact words in response to a fans group members question was that lowest point in the clubs finances will come in mis april when we will only have a million pounds left in the bank.That is quite widely reported.http://www.friendsofrangers.co.uk/1806.html Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheLawMan 6,240 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 do you believe the £14m loss included the purchase price?No. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutchy 1,200 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Don't forget D&D what the shun said about Liverpool supporters. That rag still has low sales figures there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carson's cat 744 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 I really find it difficult to believe that anyone in our support would actually think we were making a profit right now. Lawman, I don't always agree with you, but you're right on this one. I reckon the club is losing about half a million a month just now.Trublu, keep the faith, mate. DK will be back. He's just waiting for the right moment, Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simplythebest 11,453 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Lawman, I don't always agree with you, but you're right on this one. I reckon the club is losing about half a million a month just now.Trublu, keep the faith, mate. DK will be back. He's just waiting for the right moment,And again you pop back when there's a big boardroom thread.Fuckwit Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian 4,281 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Brian stockbridge's exact words in response to a fans group members question was that lowest point in the clubs finances will come in mis april when we will only have a million pounds left in the bank.That is quite widely reported.http://www.friendsofrangers.co.uk/1806.htmlWas that all he said or are you just quoting the bits that suit ?Funny to see folk quoting Stockbridge as gospel now Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAFKA 545 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 This type of in-fighting is exactly what the wanker who produced this shite was seeking.Have faith in Wallace - he would have had no hesitation in taking the 900k if if we REALLY neded it NOW.WATP Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trublusince1982 768 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 No. well we start off from different positions i think the £6.75m was spread throughout and the 5% commissions were aswell. Then take off CG IA and a couple of smaller wages from the board, also remove 400k for BS, nearly £800k from the first team staff costs, remove the £3m spent on machinery and repairs, £1.3m in contract purchases for players, take away 250K for sandaza remove the wages of goian and captain america,further reductions in wages with the removal of our head scout and the club thinks it has reduced energy bills by 10% on last season. Hospitality was expected to rise by 10% this season along with better sponsorship and merchandising figures than last year due to them being in from the start.the academy has been told to cover some of its costs with loans and sales this has begun but wont make much of a dent this season. The introduction of business partners has also brought extra revenue which wasn't there last year. Could go on and on but these are some of the reasons i believe the club was able to knock back the money for Wallace and why Mr Wallace was able to tell us there are no concerns for the immediate future. If the figures were as bad as losing a £1m a month how are we still going? Why would we pay £2m for screens and wifi? Nothing the club has done or continues to do would make any sense if we were making that kind of loss and not increasing our income. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halfwaybear 59 Posted February 2, 2014 Share Posted February 2, 2014 Tarrier meddling scaremongering shite Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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