Forfeit game! Points deduction.

[Colin Traive 22,756]

5 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Fuck knows how you managed to get that from my post. Would you like more straws to grasp wildly at?

Photo came from a celtic fan.

You got his address? Clubs don't tend to give out their players addresses. Do you think the player is going to turn around and say 'Aye, celtic knew I was away and are throwing me under the bus? Or do you think as it's currently subject to disciplinary proceedings, he'll just 'no comment' it? I know which one I think is more likely.

Which 'telling questions' would you ask? Do you know if they've been asked of celtic already? Do you know which questions I sent them?

Aye, all the papers are all in on the conspiracy too. Nobody wants to publish what would undoubtedly be a massive story and give a nice wee revenue boost to what we're constantly hearing is a dying industry.

Obviously since you're so in tune with what journos should be able to do, why don't you lay out exactly what you'd do to get to the bottom of it.

Not my job to make you competent at yours.

[Number5 2,121]

Haven't been keeping up with the Hearts situation.

What's changed that's now stopping Hearts train?

Surely it's irrelevant to which league they play in? If they comply with all H&S regulations linked to covid like the SPL clubs do and other businesses in general do, along with Risk Assessment and protocols adhered to, then what's altered to change this?

 

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Fuck knows how you managed to get that from my post. Would you like more straws to grasp wildly at?

Photo came from a celtic fan.

You got his address? Clubs don't tend to give out their players addresses. Do you think the player is going to turn around and say 'Aye, celtic knew I was away and are throwing me under the bus? Or do you think as it's currently subject to disciplinary proceedings, he'll just 'no comment' it? I know which one I think is more likely.

Which 'telling questions' would you ask? Do you know if they've been asked of celtic already? Do you know which questions I sent them?

Aye, all the papers are all in on the conspiracy too. Nobody wants to publish what would undoubtedly be a massive story and give a nice wee revenue boost to what we're constantly hearing is a dying industry.

Obviously since you're so in tune with what journos should be able to do, why don't you lay out exactly what you'd do to get to the bottom of it.

I’d use common sense and come to the same conclusion as you have. No way they didn’t know! Evidence will be there just no one wants to look for it.  For a start that celtic fan would most in likely have put that picture into some social media platform and considering that was 6 days before they played Kilmarnock it would of reached the attention of celtic way before then. 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Then you still have to question why Hearts were initially given dispensation, as i say, that's the anomaly in terms of fairness.

Hearts weren't given any special dispensation. They were allowed to return with social distancing in place. They were the only one of the 30 non Premiership SPFL sides to return given their season doesn't begin until October 6th.

“We were given permission to return to training on August 3, as was every other team that wasn’t already training. We were the team who decided to go and do it." - Robbie Neilson yesterday.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

I’d use common sense and come to the same conclusion as you have. No way they didn’t know! Evidence will be there just no one wants to look for it.  For a start that celtic fan would most in likely have put that picture into some social media platform and considering that was 6 days before they played Kilmarnock it would of reached the attention of celtic way before then. 

That's an absolute myth.

If the pic was around so early, how come it never wound up anywhere that anybody seen it?

[The Dude 20,026]

4 minutes ago, Colin Traive said:

Not my job to make you competent at yours.

Who is asking you to? I'm asking to explain how they'd go about it - then I'd pick the obvious holes in it.

[The Dude 20,026]

4 minutes ago, Number5 said:

Haven't been keeping up with the Hearts situation.

What's changed that's now stopping Hearts train?

Surely it's irrelevant to which league they play in? If they comply with all H&S regulations linked to covid like the SPL clubs do and other businesses in general do, along with Risk Assessment and protocols adhered to, then what's altered to change this?

 

A lack of faith that clubs are actually adhering to the guidelines - particularly those, like Hearts who should be training with social distancing in place (nobody outwith the Prem  had approval to return to full-contract training yet). They want to ensure they 12 who are back are dotting the i's and crossing the t's before widening it again.

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

Just now, The Dude said:

That's an absolute myth.

If the pic was around so early, how come it never wound up anywhere that anybody seen it?

You agree that it seems very unlikely that they couldn’t of known, if that’s the case there will be evidence showing that.  celtic will be forced to give their side of the story to this SPFL inquiry the telling questions should be asked then but they won’t be. 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Howsitgoing said:

You agree that it seems very unlikely that they couldn’t of known, if that’s the case there will be evidence showing that.  celtic will be forced to give their side of the story to this SPFL inquiry the telling questions should be asked then but they won’t be. 

And the longer it goes without a shred of evidence to back it up, the more likely I think it will have been that they didn't know.

So what exactly are these 'telling questions' and how do you know they haven't been asked of celtic?

Can you even tell me which questions I've already asked of them?

[GersInCanada 7,775]

What is the world coming to when even Boyd writes something sensible. No link - disreputable tabloid - so just a copy and paste.

.........................................

celtic were happy to be reinstated into the Champions League when Legia Warsaw fielded an ineligible player against them a few years ago.

If it was good enough for them to be awarded the victory, it’s now good enough for Kilmarnock.


Boli Bolingoli shouldn’t have been anywhere near Rugby Park last weekend.

The moment he stepped onto that pitch as a late substitute was the moment celtic were breaking the rules.

The SPFL should punish them accordingly and award my old club the three points.

celtic’s failure to control their player also caused their game against St Mirren to be postponed. So why should the Paisley club suffer?


The SPFL should step in and hand the victory and the three points to Jim Goodwin’s side.

celtic’s postponed game against Aberdeen — who have also stepped out of line in the past week — should see both of them lose the points.

Rearranging these games is a cop-out by the SPFL.

Neil Lennon and the influential people at celtic will tell you different, of course.


But, for me, that’s what celtic should be facing right now. And I’d be saying the same if it was Rangers.

I can hear people now arguing that the rules don’t allow that to happen.

But the SPFL have shown recently they make the rules up as they go along.

Yes, they’ve charged the two clubs and all nine players at the centre of the row.

And I know the two clubs WON’T face a points penalty or see the game shelved.

But, for me, the actions of the players were so wrong that’s exactly what should happen.


celtic v Aberdeen should be cancelled, with BOTH clubs losing the points
It would be tough on the clubs but it would befit the actions of their players.

Fact is, the powers-that-be have the authority to do whatever they like.

So there’s nothing stopping them taking a hardline stance this time. Or there shouldn’t be.

The SPFL have made it crystal clear that they don’t have free dates for postponed fixtures, that they face a major headache rearranging matches. Well, don’t rearrange them.

Award the points to Killie and St Mirren and cancel the celtic against Aberdeen match. Problem solved.

Aberdeen should also be forfeiting the points up for grabs for their other games against St Johnstone and Hamilton Accies.

I don’t think they could have any right to complain.




Sure, Bolingoli went against everything celtic told him to do. So did the Aberdeen Eight.

But clubs have been held accountable for their players before and it should be happening here.

Bolingoli has already had a police fine of £480, but I’ll spend more than that on my takeaway tonight.

There has to be something significant done about this because it’s been an utter shambles for Scottish football.

To a certain extent, I have a degree of sympathy for the Aberdeen lads.

They were wrong to do what they did, but I saw that as an honest mistake.

Bolingoli is just in a different stratosphere.

I mean, flying to Spain for a night, with everything that’s going on, simply beggars belief. He’s not just put his own health at risk and the safety of everyone who came into contact with him afterwards. He has jeopardised the future of Scottish football.

First Minister Nicola Sturgeon gives football one final chance
By all accounts, Nicola Sturgeon was ready to close the doors on the game late on Monday night when this newspaper broke the bombshell story and she only had a last- minute change of heart on Tuesday morning.

Had the First Minister decided to close the game down for the foreseeable future, clubs would have gone to the wall. No question. As it is, she has flashed a yellow card instead of a red and everyone has now been given another chance.

The penny has to drop with footballers now. They must realise how precarious Scottish football is right now. We’re also talking about people’s lives.

But then, there will always be some like Bolingoli who couldn’t care less.

I say some, because not all footballers are selfish and only interested in themselves.

There are some huge positives to being a professional footballer.

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

5 minutes ago, The Dude said:

And the longer it goes without a shred of evidence to back it up, the more likely I think it will have been that they didn't know.

So what exactly are these 'telling questions' and how do you know they haven't been asked of celtic?

Can you even tell me which questions I've already asked of them?

1: when and how did you become aware of this player being in Spain?

2: how can a player go another country and return without your knowledge?

3: why wasn’t this player aware of the requirement of quarantine after a trip to Spain?

4: the time limits that would be compromised regarding the required pre-tests? (One you’ve asked)

[Colin Traive 22,756]

18 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Who is asking you to? I'm asking to explain how they'd go about it - then I'd pick the obvious holes in it.

You’re asking me to tell you how to do your job.

Tragic.

[The Dude 20,026]

2 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

1: when and how did you become aware of this player being in Spain?

2: how can a player go another country and return without your knowledge?

3: why wasn’t this player aware of the requirement of quarantine after a trip to Spain?

4: the time limits that would be compromised regarding the required pre-tests? (One you’ve asked)

1. Asked - no response.

2. The club dont have 24 hour watch over their players. Its pretty easy to leave the country and return 24 hours without your employer knowing. Does your work know where you are at every moment.

3. He was aware.

4. Test have to be submitted 48 hours before kick off. If the player returned on Tuesday, he could well have been tested on the thursday afternoon ahead of the submission deadline on Friday (allowing for a 24 hour turnaround on results)

Funnily enough, you've missed the most telling question of them all. But I'll leave it to see if you can figure it out. I've mentioned it already over the last few days and its one that's also been asked of them.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Colin Traive said:

You’re asking me to tell you how to do your job.

Tragic.

I'm not asking you how to do my job. I'm asking what it is that people think I/we/others should be doing. Although I must admit, the failure of your reading comprehension isn't surprising. @Howsitgoing seems to have understood exactly what was meant.

[Colin Traive 22,756]

6 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

1: when and how did you become aware of this player being in Spain?

2: how can a player go another country and return without your knowledge?

3: why wasn’t this player aware of the requirement of quarantine after a trip to Spain?

4: the time limits that would be compromised regarding the required pre-tests? (One you’ve asked)

The clubs routinely hold on to passports to book flights, hotels and, where appropriate, visas for foreign matches and tours.

They knew where he was.

[Jimfanciesthedude 24,540]

41 minutes ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

Surely that's more of an issue with them being given the dispensation to train initially, that was the anomaly. To then affect Hearts by removing the dispensation, whilst breach clubs are permitted to continue, seems harsh on Hearts and every other club who were training legitly but now can't.

Anyways, going round in circles in this one, and I'm struggling with siding with Hearts for any reason. 😂

Hearts werent given dispensation, the whole championship had the chance to start training again providing they met the testing and covid protocol criteria, all other teams chose not to se early due to having to come off furlough etc

[Howsitgoing 4,281]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

1. Asked - no response.

2. The club dont have 24 hour watch over their players. Its pretty easy to leave the country and return 24 hours without your employer knowing. Does your work know where you are at every moment.

3. He was aware.

4. Test have to be submitted 48 hours before kick off. If the player returned on Tuesday, he could well have been tested on the thursday afternoon ahead of the submission deadline on Friday (allowing for a 24 hour turnaround on results)

Funnily enough, you've missed the most telling question of them all. But I'll leave it to see if you can figure it out. I've mentioned it already over the last few days and its one that's also been asked of them.

Regarding number 2 I’m afraid to say no one will be taking my picture when leaving the plane and I’m certain I could walk about the airport and not a single person will notice. Number 1 is the most telling question, if we are right they can’t answer that without more lies and that normally conjures up more questions. 

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, Colin Traive said:

The clubs routinely hold on to passports to book flights, hotels and, where appropriate, visas for foreign matches and tours.

They knew where he was.

So when did celtic book flights hotels and visas for foreign matches? An employer in the UK can't legal hold into an employees passport simply for safekeeping. 

[The Dude 20,026]

4 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

Regarding number 2 I’m afraid to say no one will be taking my picture when leaving the plane and I’m certain I could walk about the airport and not a single person will notice. Number 1 is the most telling question, if we are right they can’t answer that without more lies and that normally conjures up more questions. 

So celtic only knew because the photo came out? So when did the photo come out? Certainly never seen it anywhere until days after the story broke. 

[The Dude 20,026]

5 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

Regarding number 2 I’m afraid to say no one will be taking my picture when leaving the plane and I’m certain I could walk about the airport and not a single person will notice. Number 1 is the most telling question, if we are right they can’t answer that without more lies and that normally conjures up more questions. 

The most telling question is was the player tested in line with the rules and submitted along with the rest of the squad. 

[raging blue 1972 894]

just a wee query - did celtic not come out with a statement on the monday or tuesday saying all players have been tested twice a day since they found out.  now if they only found out on the monday is that not a strange thing to say?  could be wrong but thougth that's what i read.

[GersInCanada 7,775]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

The most telling question is was the player tested in line with the rules and submitted along with the rest of the squad. 

Total rubbish. Testing is not above the law of the land. The player had to isolate. End of story.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

42 minutes ago, Number5 said:

Haven't been keeping up with the Hearts situation.

What's changed that's now stopping Hearts train?

Surely it's irrelevant to which league they play in? If they comply with all H&S regulations linked to covid like the SPL clubs do and other businesses in general do, along with Risk Assessment and protocols adhered to, then what's altered to change this?

 

I read on a Hearts forum that they had to stop training to finish the 2019/20 cup game, as it gave them an unfair advantage to other in the league they're now in.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, GersInCanada said:

Total rubbish. Testing is not above the law of the land. The player had to isolate. End of story.

Who said it was? I've certainly not suggested anything of the sort.

If the player wasn't tested on the Thursday with the rest of the squad then celtic will have been fully aware he couldn't play.

If he was tested, someone will need to present something else to prove that celtic knew he couldnt play.

 

 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Sweetheart said:

I read on a Hearts forum that they had to stop because training to finish for the 2019/20 cup game, as it gave them an unfair advantage to other in the league they're now in.

They have five fixtures to play before the Scottish Cup semi-final.

All of the teams in that division were allowed to return to training at the exact same time as hearts. None planned to return until at least the last week of August. Only Hearts returned at the start of the month.