Forfeit game! Points deduction.

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, raging blue 1972 said:

just a wee query - did celtic not come out with a statement on the monday or tuesday saying all players have been tested twice a day since they found out.  now if they only found out on the monday is that not a strange thing to say?  could be wrong but thougth that's what i read.

No. They said players had been tested twice since Bolingoli had returned.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

Just now, The Dude said:

They have five fixtures to play before the Scottish Cup semi-final.

All of the teams in that division were allowed to return to training at the exact same time as hearts. None planned to return until at least the last week of August. Only Hearts returned at the start of the month.

So why stop hearts if they were given permission and chose to train. Who looks after that division? Have the other clubs been griping about unfair advantage? Many on the Hearts forum seem to think so.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

4 minutes ago, The Dude said:

No. They said players had been tested twice since Bolingoli had returned.

Why twice?

[GersInCanada 7,775]

6 minutes ago, Sweetheart said:

I read on a Hearts forum that they had to stop training to finish the 2019/20 cup game, as it gave them an unfair advantage to other in the league they're now in.

Hearts fans are very angry at the moment. Even if spectators are allowed for the SF Hearts will not sell anything near their allocation. 

[One Jock Wallace 858]

1 hour ago, The Dude said:

Of course, we've all just been sitting back doing nothing and letting celtic cover up something that there's no evidence to support.

See when the argument reverts to "do you think if it was us..." it just gets into the realms of the ridiculous, although if one of our players DID deliberately breach the rules then he'd deserve absolutely everything coming his way.

In what way should it be 'relatively easy' to do? Should we go speak to everyone within driving distance of Malaga in the off chance they happen to know every detail? How do you propose we do it when we can't travel to spain without the need to self-isolate for two weeks upon our return? I seen someone mention checking CCTV the other night which is as comical as it is outrageous.

Surely if they were aiming for damage limitation, they'd just not have bothered coming up with new rules on the hoof to retrospectively punish celtic and Aberdeen. It would have been much easier to say that after speaking with the clubs, the SPFL are confident they committed no wrongdoing and the blame lies with the player? It literally makes no sense to come up with new rules to cite them under if the intent isnt to punish them anyway.

Far too often folk want to delve into tinfoil hat territory. Last month it was the SFA and SPFL had bought off QCs to benefit celtic, now it's the SPFL have created rules to punish celtic as part of a damage limitation exercise.

To be fair I think when he's talking about it being easy for a journalist to find out more, he's not talking about you. Admittedly they seem to be few & far between, however there are still some real investigative journalists out there. 

[Sweetheart 8,458]

1 minute ago, GersInCanada said:

Hearts fans are very angry at the moment. Even if spectators are allowed for the SF Hearts will not sell anything near their allocation. 

They have every reason to be angry, I think most of the footballing world is unhappy with the way the SFA/SPFL have dealt with things during the covid-19 outbreak.

[GersInCanada 7,775]

Just now, Sweetheart said:

They have every reason to be angry, I think most of the footballing world is unhappy with the way the SFA/SPFL have dealt with things during the covid-19 outbreak.

Completely agree.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Sweetheart said:

They have every reason to be angry, I think most of the footballing world is unhappy with the way the SFA/SPFL have dealt with things during the covid-19 outbreak.

Most of the footballing world couldnt tell you the first thing about it. Half the folk on here who moan about it make basic factual errors, let alone folk thousands of miles away with no real interest in Scottish football.

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, Sweetheart said:

Why twice?

Because those are the protocols.

[King Jela 20,465]

1 hour ago, Amato said:

 

Would anybody be surprised if this was the genuine outcome? With Killie refysing and the SPFL just handing the game to celtic? Could be a possibility. 

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, Sweetheart said:

So why stop hearts if they were given permission and chose to train. Who looks after that division? Have the other clubs been griping about unfair advantage? Many on the Hearts forum seem to think so.

Because clubs arent following the guidelines. The SPFL looks after that division.

No. Not heard a peep from anyone suggesting an unfair advantage. Hearts fans have a victim mentality which is pushing celtic close

[The Dude 20,026]

7 minutes ago, GersInCanada said:

Hearts fans are very angry at the moment. Even if spectators are allowed for the SF Hearts will not sell anything near their allocation. 

They  rarely do.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

3 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Because those are the protocols.

They only found out on the Monday and said they had been tested twice. What days were they tested?

[The Dude 20,026]

6 minutes ago, One Jock Wallace said:

To be fair I think when he's talking about it being easy for a journalist to find out more, he's not talking about you. Admittedly they seem to be few & far between, however there are still some real investigative journalists out there. 

I know he's not talking about me specifically but I think people have this weird idea that we can just go doorstep folk for any reason and that anyone will happily answer any questions put to them.

There absolutely are investigative journalists out there. Most of them will spend months at a time working on a single story. Somehow, we're expecting results here in a matter of days.

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, Sweetheart said:

They only found out on the Monday and said they had been tested twice. What days were they tested?

Presumably the Thursday and Sunday (again, in line with the guidelines. Test before match, test after match.)

[Swally 6,289]

3 minutes ago, King Jela said:

Would anybody be surprised if this was the genuine outcome? With Killie refysing and the SPFL just handing the game to celtic? Could be a possibility. 

I genuinely don't think that's a possibility, if it did happen it would be a new low for the SPFL.

Kilmarnock would be victims of celtic's or their player's bad behaviour - and celtic would profit from it, because I have no doubt celtic would win the match.

IMO, it's more likely for Kilmarnock to be handed the 3 points, but I don't think that's very likely.

[Sweetheart 8,458]

5 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Because clubs arent following the guidelines. The SPFL looks after that division.

No. Not heard a peep from anyone suggesting an unfair advantage. Hearts fans have a victim mentality which is pushing celtic close

I meant who's the representative for that division?

[Brubear 2,928]

16 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Who said it was? I've certainly not suggested anything of the sort.

If the player wasn't tested on the Thursday with the rest of the squad then celtic will have been fully aware he couldn't play.

If he was tested, someone will need to present something else to prove that celtic knew he couldnt play.

 

 

Does it actually matter if celtic knew if he was eligible to play or not. If they were not aware of one of their players status regarding eligibility to play due to failure of internal processes then they are still responsible. If you play a suspended player because your internal processes didn't highlight his suspension when the manager selects his team then the club is still liable. 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Sweetheart said:

I meant who's the representative for that division?

Ross McArthur (Dunfermline Athletic) and Ewen Cameron (Alloa Athletic)

[Mr Soprano 13,964]

Out of interest, when would one expect to hear if further punishments will follow?

[Sweetheart 8,458]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

Presumably the Thursday and Sunday (again, in line with the guidelines. Test before match, test after match.)

Did the do any test when they found out he'd been to Spain?

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, Brubear said:

Does it actually matter if celtic knew if he was eligible to play or not. If they were not aware of one of their players status regarding eligibility to play due to failure of internal processes then they are still responsible. If you play a suspended player because your internal processes didn't highlight his suspension when the manager selects his team then the club is still liable. 

Yes. Massively,

If celtic never knew he had left the country (and therefore never knew he should be isolating) can you explain how their internal processes failed?

Suspensions see clubs sent a circular by the SFA each week expressly listing which players are suspended and how many games of their ban they have to serve.

[Swally 6,289]

1 minute ago, Brubear said:

Does it actually matter if celtic knew if he was eligible to play or not. If they were not aware of one of their players status regarding eligibility to play due to failure of internal processes then they are still responsible. If you play a suspended player because your internal processes didn't highlight his suspension when the manager selects his team then the club is still liable. 

Agreed, but only if there was a failure of internal processes, and that's key to how celtic will be treated in all of this.

[The Dude 20,026]

1 minute ago, Sweetheart said:

Did the do any test when they found out he'd been to Spain?

Yes. He'll have been tested since. As will the whole squad. Again, because those are the rules in place.

[GersInCanada 7,775]

Let's keep it simple. The player had to isolate as per government regulations and was therefore ineligible. He was allowed to work from home but not mingle with others.

Nothing more to it than that.