Footbal Chants and Sectarianism

[mmrfc1873 48]

Oh has it now..........where has it moved on?

The RIRA and CIRA are still active.....Israel and the Palestinians are still bombing each other....there are Sectarian Wars going on in Iraq and Pakistan as well as terror wars world wide....are we in a different world than 30 years ago...

It's the same old world with only different front lines

So, because other country's are having sectarian wars that means us as Rangers should not move on, and we should continue the FTP chants and sing the billy boys ?.

The Billy Boys is not sectarian and since we stopped singing it Ibrox Atmosphere is embarrassing.

I never said anything about TBB being sectarian, but it is always going to looked at that way, and yes the atmosphere at Ibrox is embarrassing, away games are much better.

Does it matter how it's looked upon?

As long as we can prove it's not sectarian we can sing it without any repercussions and stop bowing to media pressure

Yes, it does matter how it's looked upon, the Rangers board look upon it that way, that's why at one point we were aloud to sing whatever we wanted at Ibrox, now you get thrown out for singing TBB, or did at one point.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

Where have I disagreed with Murray's account of Celtics origins? He is pretty much spot-on in his account

I'm not referring to you in my last statement but others on this thread

http://forum.rangers...st&p=1058047462

Which part of my statement is innacurate or differs to Murrays?

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

I will break it down quite easily.

The way i see it the ones who want to continue singing the Billy Boys are the ones who don't believe the media,who don't read the papers and who won't bow to Roman influence.

The ones who want to stop singing it are easily led by the club and the media. The "Chamberlains" of the support as i call them.

If the club asked them to stop wearing blue to a match as it might offend i have no doubt the vast majority of the "Chamberlains" would do it.

Some are sheep in life and some are able to think for themselves and see the bigger picture.

I want us to stop singing it and I dont believe anything I read in Newspapers - on the rare occasion I actually buy one and read the Sport section

People aren't that easily defined - it's not black and white when it comes to this argument

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

There is never going to be an answer to this, the support is split in half so both sides wil never be happy.

It's not split in half lad these cunts are only shit stirring bastards.

So believing different from other people is shit stirring ?.

Thats the problem you don't believe in nothing how can you say you believe different.

I don't believe in nothing ?.

If you really are a Rangers fan (which i doubt it) you would see what real tradition and beliefs are.

While you are just being programed by the government and media propaganda with there vendetta against anything British,loyalist or Protestant.

Open your mind and explore a bit before making assumptions about something you clearly don't know about or are being taught wrong about.

Don't just watch the news read a newspaper or listen to someone and think that that's the way it is because its a big world and allot of stuff aren't talked about.

What did I tell you last night about close-mindedness?

You presume to know what people think even know you know nothing about them other than what they post on a football message board

[IfYeCannae 48]

Sorry you wasted three minutes of your life. I think you'll find the Billy Boys is bannded by EUFA.

" EUFA DIRECTIVES.

Villareal

Following the two UEFA Champions League fixtures against Villareal in February and March 2006, UEFA charged Rangers FC for being responsible for discriminatory chants sung by sections of their supporters at both matches, in particular, the ‘Billy Boys’ and ‘**** the Pope’.

Rangers challenged the charges and the UEFA Control & Disciplinary Body cleared the Club in April 2006.

UEFA appealed that decision and the Disciplinary Inspector called for the closure of parts of Ibrox stadium, as well as a CHF 35,000 fine. UEFA rules also allowed the consideration of forcing Rangers to play matches behind closed doors, as well as a stadium ban.

The UEFA Appeals Body investigated the case and again Rangers FC challenged all charges. The club was fined CHF 30,000 and the closure or partial closure of Ibrox stadium, as originally sought, was prevented. However, the Club was severely warned about its responsibility for the future conduct of supporters and a directive was issued which stated (in conjunction with the Judgment from the Appeals Body):

• ‘**** the Pope’ is discriminatory under UEFA rules

• The ‘Billy Boys’ is associated “with an attitude that is strongly sectarian and thus discriminatory”.

• The directive also instructed to the Club to implement a range of measures to demonstrate its continuing efforts to eradicate sectarianism, including the banning of supporters indulging in such behaviour, communication of anti-sectarian messages etc.

• UEFA made it clear that the singing of the Billy Boys was prohibited. Songs and chants that referred to ‘**** the Pope’ and ‘F*nians’ were also condemned. The UEFA directive referred to the ‘ethos’ of its decision and said that a club such as Rangers should be in a position to encourage behaviour that would not jeopardise the club at domestic and international fixtures.

Osasuna

Following the UEFA Cup tie against Osasuna in March 2007, Rangers were fined 20,000 Swiss francs for “discriminatory singing” by its supporters. Osasuna was fined far more heavily due to the lack of security arrangements on the night.

UEFA specifically mentioned “No Pope in Rome”, “**** the Pope” and the Billy Boys as discriminatory singing and concluded the following:

“UEFA has to send a strong message that sectarianism is unacceptable within football, especially within UEFA competitions. If Rangers FC wishes to compete in UEFA competitions, they must combat this behaviour not only on the occasion of home matches but also on the occasion of away matches. These incidents are ascribable to Rangers FC in accordance with Article 6(1) RD and must be punished accordingly.”

Since that time, the Club has continued with informal liaison with UEFA and the Scottish football authorities and it is clear that the Club and its supporters are unlikely to be given the benefit of the doubt in the future should there be further incidents".

Simple question, where did you get that directive?

[nemisis 358]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

[sonOwilliam 0]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

[opportunityknox 1]

Where have I disagreed with Murray's account of Celtics origins? He is pretty much spot-on in his account

I'm not referring to you in my last statement but others on this thread

http://forum.rangers...st&p=1058047462

Which part of my statement is innacurate or differs to Murrays?

That's self evident.

One paints a romantic picture without full context, and the other removes the romanticism and gives a more catholic (pardon the pun) view

[blue beret 29]

simple answer be a puppet of the people with an agenda against all things rangers and DONT SING IT

be your own man stand up for your right to sing it and belt it out loud as you can

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Nope, I'd rather they didn't but I am not going to tell anyone to stop singing it

[mmrfc1873 48]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Can you read at all ?. He's not telling anybody what to do.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

Where have I disagreed with Murray's account of Celtics origins? He is pretty much spot-on in his account

I'm not referring to you in my last statement but others on this thread

http://forum.rangers...st&p=1058047462

Which part of my statement is innacurate or differs to Murrays?

[/quo

That's self evident.

One paints a romantic picture without full context, and the other removes the romanticism and gives a more catholic (pardon the pun) view

But they were a club founded for Irish Catholics - which part of that is wrong??

I admit it's boiled down, that is why I said I simplified it

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

simple answer be a puppet of the people with an agenda against all things rangers and DONT SING IT

be your own man stand up for your right to sing it and belt it out loud as you can

This sort of thing annoys me - Agenda against all things Rangers???

That is pompous tripe

[sonOwilliam 0]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Nope, I'd rather they didn't but I am not going to tell anyone to stop singing it

Can i ask you why because it isn't even banned.

And you seem to have an anti Rangers traditions view.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Nope, I'd rather they didn't but I am not going to tell anyone to stop singing it

Can i ask you why because it isn't even banned.

Because I have absolutely no desire to sing about being up to my knee's in F*nian blood - Whatever the word 'F*nian' means

I'd rather sing about Rangers FC

And TBB has nothing to do with Rangers traditions - it's about a razor gang in Glasgow from the 30's

[sonOwilliam 0]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Can you read at all ?. He's not telling anybody what to do.

Can you not read he was just telling people what to do in a different polite manor

if you can't see that we don't have much hope for you.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

Damn my politeness

[minstral 5,375]

The OP said I can remember following Rangers long before the Billy Boys was sung. That is a blatant lie as i have followed the club for over 50 years and its always been sung by our fans.

[Adoniram 1,919]

I will break it down quite easily.

The way i see it the ones who want to continue singing the Billy Boys are the ones who don't believe the media,who don't read the papers and who won't bow to Roman influence.

The ones who want to stop singing it are easily led by the club and the media. The "Chamberlains" of the support as i call them.

If the club asked them to stop wearing blue to a match as it might offend i have no doubt the vast majority of the "Chamberlains" would do it.

Some are sheep in life and some are able to think for themselves and see the bigger picture.

I want us to stop singing it and I dont believe anything I read in Newspapers - on the rare occasion I actually buy one and read the Sport section

People aren't that easily defined - it's not black and white when it comes to this argument

Yes they are.You either have the balls to sing it or you don't.

You want it stopped presumably because you think it's Sectarian.What we'll never know is whether you formed that opinion based on the media and their relentless crusade against us or of your own accord for reasons i will never understand nor agree with.

[nemisis 358]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

I see you went back and edited your post after I had answered you, very sneaky.

[nemisis 358]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Can you read at all ?. He's not telling anybody what to do.

It's hard to read things when he edits his posts after people have replied to them.

[sonOwilliam 0]

What do you mean, you want to stop singing it? It's easy just stop. I think you really mean you want to act like a dictatorand stop others from singing it.

I mean I'd rather we stopped singing it

I understand people will continue regardless but I'd rather they didn't

That is still telling people what to do like a dictator.

Nope, I'd rather they didn't but I am not going to tell anyone to stop singing it

Can i ask you why because it isn't even banned.

Because I have absolutely no desire to sing about being up to my knee's in F*nian blood - Whatever the word 'F*nian' means

I'd rather sing about Rangers FC

And TBB has nothing to do with Rangers traditions - it's about a razor gang in Glasgow from the 30's

Can i ask what your perception of Rangers traditions are because honestly I'm lost with what kind of philosophy you have when it comes to Rangers.

[TravelingWilBEARy 4,319]

I will break it down quite easily.

The way i see it the ones who want to continue singing the Billy Boys are the ones who don't believe the media,who don't read the papers and who won't bow to Roman influence.

The ones who want to stop singing it are easily led by the club and the media. The "Chamberlains" of the support as i call them.

If the club asked them to stop wearing blue to a match as it might offend i have no doubt the vast majority of the "Chamberlains" would do it.

Some are sheep in life and some are able to think for themselves and see the bigger picture.

I want us to stop singing it and I dont believe anything I read in Newspapers - on the rare occasion I actually buy one and read the Sport section

People aren't that easily defined - it's not black and white when it comes to this argument

Yes they are.You either have the balls to sing it or you don't.

You want it stopped presumably because you think it's Sectarian.What we'll never know is whether you formed that opinion based on the media and their relentless crusade against us or of your own accord for reasons i will never understand nor agree with.

I formed my opinion all on my lonesome

I'd just rather sing about Rangers - I have absolutely no desire to sing about 'F*nians'

[opportunityknox 1]

Where have I disagreed with Murray's account of Celtics origins? He is pretty much spot-on in his account

I'm not referring to you in my last statement but others on this thread

http://forum.rangers...st&p=1058047462

Which part of my statement is innacurate or differs to Murrays?

[/quo

That's self evident.

One paints a romantic picture without full context, and the other removes the romanticism and gives a more catholic (pardon the pun) view

But they were a club founded for Irish Catholics - which part of that is wrong??

I admit it's boiled down, that is why I said I simplified it

If you think I am going to waste any more time on the semantics of this you're barking up the wrong tree. People can see your posts, but if anyone has jumped by the first few pages I'll refresh your memory.

This is what you said

"Like it or not they were founded to help poor Irish Catholic immigrants and I am sure most Celtic fans are proud of this"

That statement is romantic codswallop, and Murray's account paints a completely different picture. You know it and I know it.

So does everyone else.

If you wish to go round in circles on this point, feel free.

I'll let everyone else draw their own conclusions.

Now, TBB.

Did you sing the song before it was "banned"?