Scottish football clubs urged to apologise for historical child sex abuse

[King Jela 20,361]

20 minutes ago, The Dude said:

Why would they have reservations about giving it credibility? Are we suggesting the victims are lying?

Because none of the starements above were anything more than PR nonsense. They'd have been as well releasing no statements. 

[Hadron Collider 30,883]

1 minute ago, Inigo said:

Seems to me the most likely event is that RN were fed a line by someone at the club re Neely. The idea that Neely knew the editor and had a few innocuous lines published about his departure feels far fetched, and the idea that nobody that new what really happened would have seen that and taken issue with it takes some believing. Either way, these questions need asked, and I struggle to believe folk would be reacting the same way to this if it was sellic and the sellic view. 

Same with reporting to the police. We should be investigating ourselves the realities of that. And whether Neely could have gone on to work elsewhere, and if we did everything reasonable at the time to prevent that. And if not then relevant apologies. 

We need to be open about all of this. Too much of a stench of defensiveness in this thread tbh. Wrongs being righted are the be all and end all. If it means folk, the dude or whoever else, asking hard questions, then so be it.

The father of one of the victims apparently was a policeman mate. He could’ve easily taken this further. Different era though. 

[scottyscott1963 18,328]

2 hours ago, Howsitgoing said:

What caused his career to effectively end within SFA remit football clubs whilst he was only in his mid 40’s? 

They didn’t take the allegations seriously enough and should of stopped the bullying by the other coaches that seem to have occurred. 

This is why we cannot rush this through.
I am not saying this kid wasn't picked on after Neely got his marching orders.
What happened was exactly what paedophiles set out to do,and that is isolate a kid,and the kid felt so insecure that what happened should make him feel guilt about the rat getting sacked.
He maybe expected to be picked on.
I have absolutely no doubt he has carried what happened to him all his life,different people handle situations in different ways.
As a kid and being part of a large group we knew who to avoid,and they were present,especially the dirty old men in raincoats hanging about where kids were present.
So i suppose i came through my childhood safety in numbers.

[tannerall 25,935]

3 minutes ago, King Jela said:

Did you read the statements? Falkirk issued no apology and Motherwell and Partick offered apoligies for 'victims of the game'. They weren't apologising for their own involvment in the abuse the victims allegedly recieved. 

Not really the Dudes fault. 

Anyone reading this garbage of unsubstantiated report would assume they were apologies too.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/feb/11/scottish-football-sexual-abuse-review-calls-on-clubs-to-apologise

 

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, King Jela said:

Did you read the statements? Falkirk issued no apology and Motherwell and Partick offered apoligies for 'victims of the game'. They weren't apologising for their own involvment in the abuse the victims allegedly recieved. 

It is, it's just not a very well worded one. All four statements are designed to say roughly the same thing and (knowing the people involved in writing each of them) the differences make a bit of sense

 

 

[Inigo 32,526]

Just now, Hadron Collider said:

The father of one of the victims apparently was a policeman mate. He could’ve easily taken this further. Different era though. 

Yeah, don't see how reneging our responsibilities because his father was a police officer helps. I wouldn't say it's appropriate to fail to call the police through official channels because a victim's father is a polis.

We should have called the police and I hope we did.

[King Jela 20,361]

Just now, The Dude said:

It is, it's just not a very well worded one. All four statements are designed to say roughly the same thing and (knowing the people involved in writing each of them) the differences make a bit of sense

 

 

That's about as nothing an answer as I was expecting tbh. I'd actually be really disappointed if Rangers came out with statements as pathetic as those. 

PR statements just to make sure you're ticked off the "at least we did something" list for a topic as serious as this helps no one. 

[Bad Robot 21,150]

5 minutes ago, Hadron Collider said:

The father of one of the victims apparently was a policeman mate. He could’ve easily taken this further. Different era though. 

It’s not beyond reason that the father and a few of his mates gave neely a late night visit 

[southcoastbear 1,639]

9 minutes ago, Howsitgoing said:

I don’t think the inquiry can help with that and that should of been the number one priority. Clubs can’t conclusively pay out compensation based on this inquiry, there’s no conclusive failure in Rangers part. They might or might not have contacted the police;the individual might or might not have went on to other clubs; the extract showed Rangers letting the individual leave with best wishes but also states that Rangers dismissed the individual immediately. This inquiry is a joke and it is disgusting. 

Agreed bud,  pretty much what I was saying, cut the bollox and help these people.

 

[Hadron Collider 30,883]

1 minute ago, Inigo said:

Yeah, don't see how reneging our responsibilities because his father was a police officer helps. I wouldn't say it's appropriate to fail to call the police through official channels because a victim's father is a polis.

We should have called the police and I hope we did.

This is where it could get cloudy. The father being a cop might’ve called it off even if we called the police. 

[tannerall 25,935]

Just now, Inigo said:

Yeah, don't see how reneging our responsibilities because his father was a police officer helps. I wouldn't say it's appropriate to fail to call the police through official channels because a victim's father is a polis.

We should have called the police and I hope we did.

In those days I actually believe that the alleged allegations, would not have been as high a priority as they would today, and like domestic abuse would not have been seen as serious by the police, or would have been dealt with internally by institutions. Shocking I know, but probably true.

For instance would an employer have reported an assault at training, or sexual abuse of a female employee at that time, as strictly as they do now ? Unfortunately again, I think not.

[King Jela 20,361]

"We acknowledge what happened and are very sorry if anyone got hurt in the Scottish game" - basically what those 4 said. That's what we should be doing? Saying sorry but no really? Fuck off. 

[Hadron Collider 30,883]

2 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

It’s not beyond reason that the father and a few of his mates gave neely a late night visit 

Yeah mate, already thought of that. 👍

[The Dude 20,026]

3 minutes ago, King Jela said:

That's about as nothing an answer as I was expecting tbh. I'd actually be really disappointed if Rangers came out with statements as pathetic as those. 

PR statements just to make sure you're ticked off the "at least we did something" list for a topic as serious as this helps no one. 

'At least we did something' is better than 'we did fuck all'.

[The Dude 20,026]

Celtic welcomes the publication of the Final Report following the Independent Review of Sexual Abuse in Scottish Football. The Club recognises the courage of all those who came forward and contributed to this review.  
 
The abuse of young people is an abhorrent crime, which has unfortunately affected many organisations within Scottish football, indeed Scottish society as a whole.
 
The Club has publicly expressed its sincere sympathy, regret and sorrow to all those affected across Scottish football including at Celtic Football Club and Celtic Boys’ Club, something which the Independent Review acknowledged and welcomed. Today we reiterate this apology. 
 
Since the publication of the Interim Report, Celtic has been working with the Scottish FA and Scottish football as a whole to review those recommendations and to strive to make Scottish football a safer place for our young people. The Club remains fully committed to continuing to prioritise welfare and safeguarding protections for our young people, including working with the Scottish FA in respect of the Recommendations in this Report.

[King Jela 20,361]

Just now, The Dude said:

'At least we did something' is better than 'we did fuck all'.

Is it? When the 'something' you did helps absolutely no one? 

How are victims of Falkirk Fc, for example, going to feel if/when they read Falkirk's 'apology' knowing fine well they aren't directly apologising for their specific actions but action within the Scottish game? That isn't taking responsibility. 

[scottyscott1963 18,328]

16 minutes ago, Bad Robot said:

an earlier poster added the amount of times we were mentioned in the report  compared to the east end club who have had numerous convictions. There’s also the issue if we’ve done nothing in regards to conducting our own investigation which again is a failing on our club and I do expect better. 
As said we can acknowledge the report without giving it credence and still offer a general apology which will probably come today at some point.

I'll say it again mate.
The collective shaming is a ploy to ease the burden on a club who are sitting there with thier fingers in their ears.
At this moment in time i am 100% positive Rangers board will be taking legal advice on this,and when the time is right we will accept all responsibility expected of us.

[King Jela 20,361]

2 minutes ago, The Dude said:

celtic welcomes the publication of the Final Report following the Independent Review of Sexual Abuse in Scottish Football. The Club recognises the courage of all those who came forward and contributed to this review.  
 
The abuse of young people is an abhorrent crime, which has unfortunately affected many organisations within Scottish football, indeed Scottish society as a whole.
 
The Club has publicly expressed its sincere sympathy, regret and sorrow to all those affected across Scottish football including at celtic Football Club and celtic Boys’ Club, something which the Independent Review acknowledged and welcomed. Today we reiterate this apology. 
 
Since the publication of the Interim Report, celtic has been working with the Scottish FA and Scottish football as a whole to review those recommendations and to strive to make Scottish football a safer place for our young people. The Club remains fully committed to continuing to prioritise welfare and safeguarding protections for our young people, including working with the Scottish FA in respect of the Recommendations in this Report.

Again, no apology in that. No responsibility taking in that at all. 

[Inigo 32,526]

5 minutes ago, Hadron Collider said:

This is where it could get cloudy. The father being a cop might’ve called it off even if we called the police. 

The police don't need a victim, or the victim's father's permission to investigate a crime or a criminal.

Regardless, that's their issue. Our responsibility is to keep ourselves right and do the right thing.

[The Dude 20,026]

Just now, King Jela said:

Is it? When the 'something' you did helps absolutely no one? 

How are victims of Falkirk Fc, for example, going to feel if/when they read Falkirk's 'apology' knowing fine well they aren't directly apologising for their specific actions but action within the Scottish game? That isn't taking responsibility. 

Falkirk are probably a bad choice as none of the victims identified were abused there (one of those convicted did but there's been no allegations).

Partick (who have had allegations) have worked really closely with victim's groups etc and afaik have been directly in contact with them where possible to apologise directly.

[tannerall 25,935]

15 minutes ago, Hadron Collider said:

The father of one of the victims apparently was a policeman mate. He could’ve easily taken this further. Different era though. 

Nice bit of spotting the obvious HC, well done. 

[King Jela 20,361]

1 minute ago, The Dude said:

Falkirk are probably a bad choice as none of the victims identified were abused there (one of those convicted did but there's been no allegations).

Partick (who have had allegations) have worked really closely with victim's groups etc and afaik have been directly in contact with them where possible to apologise directly.

'Where possible' so have they or haven't they? 

[Inigo 32,526]

8 minutes ago, tannerall said:

In those days I actually believe that the alleged allegations, would not have been as high a priority as they would today, and like domestic abuse would not have been seen as serious by the police, or would have been dealt with internally by institutions. Shocking I know, but probably true.

For instance would an employer have reported an assault at training, or sexual abuse of a female employee at that time, as strictly as they do now ? Unfortunately again, I think not.

May or may not be so. Doesn't mean we shouldn't be self critical of the way we, as a part of society, did things in the past.

Maybe folk didn't report these things, but that was wrong. I mean, we were all willing to say 'all you needed to do was pick up the phone' before now. Were we all just point scoring or did we believe it?

[scottyscott1963 18,328]

11 minutes ago, Inigo said:

Yeah, don't see how reneging our responsibilities because his father was a police officer helps. I wouldn't say it's appropriate to fail to call the police through official channels because a victim's father is a polis.

We should have called the police and I hope we did.

Honestly not going to get drawn on this Inigo.
The club said it WAS reported to the police,and that is why the police said they had no records of any report.
Are people assuming it was bacause his Dad was an officer and that was who it was reported to has caused the confusion.
But i believe the person who stated we reported this by the rule of law.
 

[McEwan's Lager 30,523]

Just now, Inigo said:

May or may not be so. Doesn't mean we shouldn't be self critical of the way we, as a part of society, did things in the past.

Maybe folk didn't report these things, but that was wrong. I mean, we were all willing to say 'all you needed to do was pick up the phone' before now. Were we all just point scoring or did we believe it?

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