cushynumber 25,178 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 I'm not against loans per se, but in the past a lot of times you felt the guys coming on loan here felt it was a step up and were trying to get into OUR team for the long run. The tables have turned though - now the way they talk its obvious they simply see us as a means to an end - a stepping stone to bigger and better things (so they think) - even in someone like Dom Balls place when he struggled here, they still chase the rainbow of the EPL (or to be more exact the pot of gold at the end of that rainbow). I understand why we get loans in, but these guys dont look like they have any intention of joining us for the long haul. They have their big contracts at the bigger clubs, they pick up their mega wages, they then go on loan here and there, seeing out their contracts - having achieved nothing in the game - but retire as millionaires with the gorgeous wife, and the gorgeous hoose and the gorgeous dug. Nothing rams home to me more than these guys talking, how far the club has fallen in relation to the supposed "elite " clubs of football such as fuckin Arsenal. We are just a way for the bigger clubs to push out players who are never going to see their own first team, to see out their contract. Like it or lump it, that is the reality. Bobby Hume and Jack The Flipper 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnberry18 3,204 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, BlueThunder said: This is from Warburton himself :- “I think his best position is probably the ten, in behind the striker. He can also play wide right, wide left, he can play eight, so we have that flexibility and the options to look at. It's obvious that he will be taking the attacking midfield position; we already have width, but our midfield is where we need improvement. Will be interesting to see how he affects the form of our strikers. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smile 26,610 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 9 minutes ago, Lloyd72 said: There is value in that league imo, just look at some of the players he signed at brentford on the cheap who have went for millions, Hogan, Tarkowski and Gray to name a few How much did they all cost at the time as i don't know? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prso's headband 35,516 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Just now, BridgeIsBlue said: You're not the only one mate. The way I see it is these two guys could come up here and be our best players until the end of the season then what? Back to square one again in the summer. With Holt and Halliday unhappy at being frozen out for 6 months as well. If these guys play extremely better than those two then the fans won't buy them coming back into the team when these two go. Complex situation which has trickled from the top of the tree. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smile 26,610 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 1 minute ago, cushynumber said: I'm not against loans per se, but in the past a lot of times you felt the guys coming on loan here felt it was a step up and were trying to get into OUR team for the long run. The tables have turned though - now the way they talk its obvious they simply see us as a means to an end - a stepping stone to bigger and better things (so they think) - even in someone like Dom Balls place when he struggled here, they still chase the rainbow of the EPL (or to be more exact the pot of gold at the end of that rainbow). I understand why we get loans in, but these guys dont look like they have any intention of joining us for the long haul. They have their big contracts at the bigger clubs, they pick up their mega wages, they then go on loan here and there, seeing out their contracts - having achieved nothing in the game - but retire as millionaires with the gorgeous wife, and the gorgeous hoose and the gorgeous dug. Nothing rams home to me more than these guys talking, how far the club has fallen in relation to the supposed "elite " clubs of football such as fuckin Arsenal. We are just a way for the bigger clubs to push out players who are never going to see their own first team, to see out their contract. Like it or lump it, that is the reality. Dom ball was daft he must have seen a rainbow with a pot of gold rather than a career. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Happy to see what they can do I think they'll be good additions to be honest (could be wrong tho) struggling to get excited by them but not because of them just because the seasons bust and it's too little too late really if they impress there's always next season if they enjoy it here Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lloyd72 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Smile said: How much did they all cost at the time as i don't know? Hogan cost 800k and they're rejecting bids of 12 million for him now Gray was 500k and went for 10 million Tarkowski was an undisclosed fee but they sold him for 6 million so it must have been at least 4 million profit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnberry18 3,204 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Walter wasn't averse to using the loan market, Bartley and Wiess came into teams a lot stronger than this one. It will depend how we use it, and if we don't overly rely on it. We need strength in midfield, and then the manager has a lot to think about in terms of our existing midfield come the summer. We still have things to play for this season and the team needs strengthening. If we can sign players permanently as well, then it's good we are making ourselves stronger right now. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smile 26,610 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Lloyd72 said: Hogan cost 800k and they're rejecting bids of 12 million for him now Gray was 500k and went for 10 million Tarkowski was an undisclosed fee but they sold him for 6 million so it must have been at least 4 million profit. All decent fees but we aren't the big sell to players and Warburton won't be getting that kind of money upfront, which is why he's struggling now we will never know what his first picks are/were. Warburton said himself if any deal comes down to money we won't get the Player, which id damming. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cushynumber 25,178 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Smile said: Dom ball was daft he must have seen a rainbow with a pot of gold rather than a career. mate the problem is its maybe £30K a week, to sit doing fuck all or maybe go on another loan till your contract expires - or come to us for £5k a week, but actually achieve something in your career. Too many will simply take the money - they have wives, mortgages etc. Even when their contract runs down - they will probably move to a smaller club but be on better wages than we can offer - they dont seem to care about playing in front of one mand and his dog if he is bringing in £15K a week rather than £8K Outwith about 25 teams , the Sky TV money has destroyed football in the UK. Bobby Hume 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smile 26,610 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, cushynumber said: mate the problem is its maybe £30K a week, to sit doing fuck all or maybe go on another loan till your contract expires - or come to us for £5k a week, but actually achieve something in your career. Too many will simply take the money - they have wives, mortgages etc. Even when their contract runs down - they will probably move to a smaller club but be on better wages than we can offer - they dont seem to care about playing in front of one mand and his dog if he is bringing in £15K a week rather than £8K Outwith about 25 teams , the Sky TV money has destroyed football in the UK. Not really to do with the topic but.. I was watching sky sports the other night and Oscar came on he was talking about his China deal they asked him about the Standard of his teammates and how they compared to the guys at Chelsea he said they weren't as good then they asked him about the money his eyes lit up and he said it was very good, he's only 25 and to me has killed his career for cash it seems the modern way now. Blue Rino and Bobby Hume 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueThunder 8,454 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 If these guys do well and ensure we finish strongly then I'm sure most of us will be happy. Who knows, perhaps the loans might even be extended into next season. Hopefully we'll see the other injuries coming back towards the end of the season too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSM 20,892 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 31 minutes ago, cushynumber said: I'm not against loans per se, but in the past a lot of times you felt the guys coming on loan here felt it was a step up and were trying to get into OUR team for the long run. The tables have turned though - now the way they talk its obvious they simply see us as a means to an end - a stepping stone to bigger and better things (so they think) - even in someone like Dom Balls place when he struggled here, they still chase the rainbow of the EPL (or to be more exact the pot of gold at the end of that rainbow). I understand why we get loans in, but these guys dont look like they have any intention of joining us for the long haul. They have their big contracts at the bigger clubs, they pick up their mega wages, they then go on loan here and there, seeing out their contracts - having achieved nothing in the game - but retire as millionaires with the gorgeous wife, and the gorgeous hoose and the gorgeous dug. Nothing rams home to me more than these guys talking, how far the club has fallen in relation to the supposed "elite " clubs of football such as fuckin Arsenal. We are just a way for the bigger clubs to push out players who are never going to see their own first team, to see out their contract. Like it or lump it, that is the reality. Gorgeous dug? Weirdo. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cushynumber 25,178 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Just now, FSM said: Gorgeous dug? Weirdo. they have always got a gorgeous dug Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyson1872 2,923 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 28 minutes ago, Lloyd72 said: Hogan cost 800k and they're rejecting bids of 12 million for him now Gray was 500k and went for 10 million Tarkowski was an undisclosed fee but they sold him for 6 million so it must have been at least 4 million profit. Tark was around 250k Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Hume 13,122 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 20 minutes ago, cushynumber said: I'm not against loans per se, but in the past a lot of times you felt the guys coming on loan here felt it was a step up and were trying to get into OUR team for the long run. The tables have turned though - now the way they talk its obvious they simply see us as a means to an end - a stepping stone to bigger and better things (so they think) - even in someone like Dom Balls place when he struggled here, they still chase the rainbow of the EPL (or to be more exact the pot of gold at the end of that rainbow). I understand why we get loans in, but these guys dont look like they have any intention of joining us for the long haul. They have their big contracts at the bigger clubs, they pick up their mega wages, they then go on loan here and there, seeing out their contracts - having achieved nothing in the game - but retire as millionaires with the gorgeous wife, and the gorgeous hoose and the gorgeous dug. Nothing rams home to me more than these guys talking, how far the club has fallen in relation to the supposed "elite " clubs of football such as fuckin Arsenal. We are just a way for the bigger clubs to push out players who are never going to see their own first team, to see out their contract. Like it or lump it, that is the reality. Good Post Cushy .... ...... And as long as we have our super rich neighbour down in England getting the (3) lions' share of television monies out there ..... it will sadly not change in the near future. The alternative is to be part of an Atlantic league .... or similar set-up for teams like ourselves ..... who play in leagues way below their earning potential .... where more money is available to the members of this league, allowing the clubs the opportunity of attracting better players to their ranks ..... as the current situation is non productive and is only fostering slow stagnation .... cushynumber 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal Bear 72 363 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 44 minutes ago, VladimirWeiss69 said: Oh, well thats a bit disappointing, only really want to sign loan players if we have a chance to sign them, what the point in signing players like these if the league is already over and he might not be our player by the end of the season. To strengthen the squad until the end of the season. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torontoblue76 120 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 In six months/eight months time we could be in a very different place with European revenue, a season of sold-out home games and some of the lesser performers sold on for a profit. E.g. if someone came in and offered 500,000 for Kiernan we would be making around 900% on the deal. We'll also be able to improve our sponsorship contracts. All of which will mean more money to spend on players, and I've not yet spoken about new investment from a share issue. Having said that, we will never, ever compete with the clubs down south until we join them. Here's a sobering thought: even if the unmentionables sell Dembele for 20 million, their entire revenue this year INCLUDING that sale will be less than the money Arsenal get from TV rights this year. (approx 50-60m their revenue; TV rights in EPL = 66 million) Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bears&Reds 460 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Torontoblue76 said: Having said that, we will never, ever compete with the clubs down south until we join them. Here's a sobering thought: even if the unmentionables sell Dembele for 20 million, their entire revenue this year INCLUDING that sale will be less than the money Arsenal get from TV rights this year. (approx 50-60m their revenue; TV rights in EPL = 66 million) The disparity is greater than that, last season Arsenal banked £100 million from TV rights, the bottom club Villa banked £66 million, this season with the new tv deals included the top club is estimated to lift £145 million with the bottom club picking up approx £97 million. Torontoblue76 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Hume 13,122 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 32 minutes ago, Smile said: Not really to do with the topic but.. I was watching sky sports the other night and Oscar came on he was talking about his China deal they asked him about the Standard of his teammates and how they compared to the guys at Chelsea he said they weren't as good then they asked him about the money his eyes lit up and he said it was very good, he's only 25 and to me has killed his career for cash it seems the modern way now. Correct mate ...... so the chances of us signing someone of his calibre (or half of it) are all down to the amount we can put into his bank account ... makes you sick ... but the reality of modern football is unfortunately (for all football fans) as you posted .... all about the cash. Smile 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterD 7,435 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Hopefully the loans do well. It's a worry that we don't have money because come the summer we'll be looking at bargain basement signings again. Guys who have lost their way, guys past their best, young guys with little experience. I can't moan too much about the loan signings this window though, I didn't want the manager being given any money plus he already said a couple of loans is what we'd be looking at. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cushynumber 25,178 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, Bears&Reds said: The disparity is greater than that, last season Arsenal banked £100 million from TV rights, the bottom club Villa banked £66 million, this season with the new tv deals included the top club is estimated to lift £145 million with the bottom club picking up approx £97 million. nearly £100 Million for being absolutely shite. Do Sky really think paying Hull City that amount of money - who not a soul in the world outside Hull watches - is actually worth it? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torontoblue76 120 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, cushynumber said: nearly £100 Million for being absolutely shite. Do Sky really think paying Hull City that amount of money - who not a soul in the world outside Hull watches - is actually worth it? agree with you all the way. But over here in Canada the pubs are full of guys every Saturday breakfast-time watching the "EPL" - I sometimes think if you stuck on Blue Square Cement Premier league and called it EPL they'd be happy. It's now a phenomenal marketing success all over the world, to my surprise and I'm sure that of many others. I know we all know this, but it's only in the last 5 years or so that footballer's wages have caught up with NBA and NFL wages. No-one would bat an eyelid at paying an average NBA player three million pounds a season - and Magic Johnson? 100m three-year deal? Rooney's 10 million quid a year in China is still peanuts in comparison...as Warburton has said, there is a long, long way still to run if soccer is going to be the global sport in money terms. Now let's see if the SPL can market the game successfully to get more revenue in. Though again, I think we all know the answer to that one... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaz52 11,837 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Happy he's signed. He'll bring genuine quality to our squad, this can only be a good thing Loyal-Bear 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
50ShadesofBlue 667 Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 Don't know if anyone mentioned it but his Arsenal contract expires 2018. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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