James Tavernier

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

25 minutes ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said:

He's international level because Northern Ireland are pish. Their squad is littered with League 1 players and until he moved in the summer their number 1 goalie played for fucking Hamilton

Your logic is seriously flawed.

Aye, so pish they got to Euro 2016 top out of a fairly tough group, and then got to the second round. Wish Scotland were that shite.

Not really, it takes a certain level of ability to make any of the UK national sides.

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

3 minutes ago, OnwardsandUpwards said:

Actually disagree.Think Tav has been better in these games because Hodson was there to help HIM out and cover his total lack of positional awareness.

Hodson isn't flashy but he is the better defender of the 2 and has managed to get himself into good positions and his name on the score sheet.The main reason I prefer him though is defence looks better balanced when he plays plus he bursts a gut to get back into position unlike jog along Tav.

That said I do think our defence are easy target due to the complete lack of options made available in front of them.Even the best defenders in the world would be exposed again and again with our so called midfielders in front of them!

Spot on.

[WGOH 2,344]

47 minutes ago, ayrshireranger said:

Cannot agree on any of that. Hodson is a NI international, he dosent need a League 1 level player to help him out. Sorry, but that's just nonsense.

I have watched him most games this season and fail to see this average to hopeless player you state. He is a solid, unflashy player, who wont get flying as much as Tav, but is a better defender, rarely wasted a pass this season unlike Tav, has miles better positional sense.

I'd take him over Tav anyday. A better and more consistent player. I wouldn't have to worry about him the way I do about Tav, who can be great one game and awful the next.

 

11 minutes ago, OnwardsandUpwards said:

Actually disagree.Think Tav has been better in these games because Hodson was there to help HIM out and cover his total lack of positional awareness.

Hodson isn't flashy but he is the better defender of the 2 and has managed to get himself into good positions and his name on the score sheet.The main reason I prefer him though is defence looks better balanced when he plays plus he bursts a gut to get back into position unlike jog along Tav.

That said I do think our defence are easy target due to the complete lack of options made available in front of them.Even the best defenders in the world would be exposed again and again with our so called midfielders in front of them!

Ok, fair enough, you both have your opinion, I have mine - that's fair. I know Tav isn't a terrific defender but he offers us so much more than just defending. Ok, that's what a full backs main purpose is, defending, but they also have to offer something going forward, which Tav does and Hodson doesn't. Also, I don't think Hodson is this ultra consistent and reliable defender people go on about. Motherwell at home he was honking, StJ at ibrox, set up the their goal - just a couple of examples and I'd prefer Tav over him.

[WGOH 2,344]

6 minutes ago, ayrshireranger said:

Aye, so pish they got to Euro 2016 out of a tough group, and then got to the QF's. Wish Scotland were that shite.

Not really, it takes a certain level of ability to make any of the UK national sides.

Did Hodson even play at the Euros? They had players like Magennis, McGovern and McGinnin their team, hardly an elite list of spl players  

[OnwardsandUpwards 834]

3 minutes ago, WGOH said:

 

Ok, fair enough, you both have your opinion, I have mine - that's fair. I know Tav isn't a terrific defenders but he offers us so much more than just defending. Ok, that's what a full backs main purpose is, defending, but they also have to offer something going forward, which Tav does and Hodson doesn't. Also, I don't think Hodson is this ultra con sister and reliable defender people go on about. Motherwell at home he was honking, StJ at ibrox, set up the their goal - just a couple of examples and I'd prefer Tav over him.

Well said mate we do all have our own opinions and always like reading well thought out replies and posts even when they have differing views to mine.

Do agree Tav is better going forward but Hodson is a better defender.All we can hope is we have people now at our club who can identify a player who has BOTH qualities?

[LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510]

54 minutes ago, ayrshireranger said:

Aye, so pish they got to Euro 2016 top out of a fairly tough group, and then got to the second round. Wish Scotland were that shite.

Not really, it takes a certain level of ability to make any of the UK national sides.

Punched above their weight and scraped though and Hodson didn't play a single minute of it.

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

2 hours ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said:

Punched above their weight and scraped though and Hodson didn't play a single minute of it.

Yes, but still made their squad and played in the qualifiers.

[LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510]

2 minutes ago, ayrshireranger said:

Yes, but still made their squad and played in the qualifiers.

Nope. Never played in them either.

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

4 minutes ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said:

Nope. Never played in them either.

Hmmm, thought he did. TBH didn't follow them until they made it to 2016. You and I don't see eye to eye on this. I'd take Hodson, you'd take Tav. Lets just leave it there.

[LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510]

Just now, ayrshireranger said:

Whatever. Listen mate, you and I don't see eye to eye on this. I'd take Hodson, you'd take Tav. Lets just leave it there.

We don't see eye to eye mainly because your full argument was that Hodson is an international and Tavernier is a League 1 player when in actual fact they're both League 1 players it just happens that one of them happens to sit on the bench for Northern Ireland from time to time.

Apologies for destroying that myth.

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

18 minutes ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said:

We don't see eye to eye mainly because your full argument was that Hodson is an international and Tavernier is a League 1 player when in actual fact they're both League 1 players it just happens that one of them happens to sit on the bench for Northern Ireland from time to time.

Apologies for destroying that myth.

What myth?. Hodson HAS represented his country. 19 times, oh and just one sub appearance. 18 starts.

The only myth here was yours: that NI are pish.

Pish teams don't top their Euro group with 21 points, beat Greece, Hungary and Romania, get to a major tournament, and beat Ukraine.

[ayrshireranger 8,176]

19 minutes ago, LaudrupsPatrickBoots said:

Nope. Never played in them either.

Still good enough to make the Euro squad though.

[LaudrupsPatrickBoots 13,510]

28 minutes ago, ayrshireranger said:

Still good enough to make the Euro squad though.

So we've went from saying he played in the Euros to saying he played in the qualifiers but now it's just an achievement that he made the squad. Talk about clutching at straws

I think he's a decent player but this argument that being a bit part player for an average at best international side somehow makes him better than Tav is ridiculous.

And less than half of those whopping 19 caps have been in competitive games. He gets a run out for friendlies and fills in for injuries that's about it.

[MasterD 7,436]

5 hours ago, RDB14 said:

Keep Tav. Instrumental In many of our goals. I think he has plenty improvement ahead of him and with more quality around him will only raise his game. A good centre back pairing would cover a lot of his flaws. His flaws are brutally exposed in part because our defence are pish.

A pacey CB that can read the game would sort out a lot of the balls that get played behind Tav when he's out of position.

Kiernan tends to stay in the centre rather than push over and Wilson & Hill are too slow to get over. Happens at both full back areas.

At our level we'll either get a RB that can defend but offers little going forward, or someone better going forward but causes ourselves problems at the back. It depends on the rest of the system which will suit us better.

[Del 667]

4mins gone, brilliant ball into the box but again the strikers are caught on their heels and the defender gets there first. 

We should be at the very least be getting a shot at goal from that!!!

[Aubie92 1,074]

On 2017-5-10 at 11:21 PM, MasterD said:

A pacey CB that can read the game would sort out a lot of the balls that get played behind Tav when he's out of position.

Kiernan tends to stay in the centre rather than push over and Wilson & Hill are too slow to get over. Happens at both full back areas.

At our level we'll either get a RB that can defend but offers little going forward, or someone better going forward but causes ourselves problems at the back. It depends on the rest of the system which will suit us better.

Rashid Sumaila apparently has that same tendency as Amoruso and Bougherra to bomb forward at times. If that's true and he's definitely on his way, we'd be better with the full back who is more defensively solid.

[Creampuff 22,628]

Once we sort the midfield, all of a sudden Tav will be asked to do half the defending and will look twice as good.

[wullyRFC 5,230]

If he learned to complete a 10 yard pass he still wouldn't be good enough.

[MasterD 7,436]

7 minutes ago, Aubie92 said:

Rashid Sumaila apparently has that same tendency as Amoruso and Bougherra to bomb forward at times. If that's true and he's definitely on his way, we'd be better with the full back who is more defensively solid.

Full backs going forward happen all the way through a game. A CB might go a couple of times. It's not hard to teach a midfielder or full back to sit when they see a CB go forward.

Buying a defensively minded RB so your CB can bomb forward is actually ridiculous.

[Aubie92 1,074]

35 minutes ago, Creampuff said:

Once we sort the midfield, all of a sudden Tav will be asked to do half the defending and will look twice as good.

If he becomes more disciplined, maybe. There are times where he chases the ball like a heidless chicken though, and that can't be blamed on the midfield. 

29 minutes ago, MasterD said:

Full backs going forward happen all the way through a game. A CB might go a couple of times. It's not hard to teach a midfielder or full back to sit when they see a CB go forward.

Buying a defensively minded RB so your CB can bomb forward is actually ridiculous.

I agree with you, but that's not what I suggested. Tav often doesn't track back to his position when an attacking play breaks down, and instead chases the ball. We've been caught out time and again with it as our centre backs aren't quick enough to cover him - and Kiernan isn't a natural centre back - and if we have a centre back getting caught up the pitch and Tav out of position too then it won't matter how quick the other two members of the defence are. 

If you've got a full back like Tav who will often leave his centre back exposed, you need that centre back to have pace to cover for him; if you're playing with a centre back who gets caught out further up the pitch at times, he needs someone quick alongside him at the back to cover for him - but that centre back can't cover two players at once. 

Again though, I've only seen clips of Sumaila and I'm basing him having those tendencies based on what others have said. He might turn out to be the exact opposite. And even if he does bomb forward, how big of an issue that is would depend on the formation too, in fairness. 

[centenarystand 2,227]

His final ball is woeful time and again, get him to fuck along with the rest of Warbutons signings.

[PRW. 5,631]

Poor second half from him but he is one of our better players. We can't replace the full team in the summer so hopefully he is one of the ones to stay.

[Blue Avenger 22,567]

An absolute fucking imposter. His body language is worse than his football. Utter shite. He was defo playing at the wrong stadium today. Fucking waster.

[cushynumber 25,178]

I like him actually, but he just throws in these absolutely terrible performances every so often that are just so annoying. 

[Blue Avenger 22,567]

2 hours ago, MasterD said:

Full backs going forward happen all the way through a game. A CB might go a couple of times. It's not hard to teach a midfielder or full back to sit when they see a CB go forward.

Buying a defensively minded RB so your CB can bomb forward is actually ridiculous.

Yes, nearly as bad as having a defender who can't defend and has no end product when it does go forward. Tav is an imposter. End of.