Jump to content
NeoGeo7

Murty wants to emulate Southampton model

Recommended Posts

7 hours ago, K.A.I said:

Exactly. Said since Warburton's early days that if it was as easy as going to Swindon, Walsall, MK Dons, Accrington Stanley, Wigan, Preston, QPR and Wigan and taking one of their better players for a few hundred grand a time, play them a bit and all of a sudden they turn into multi-million pound talents then everycunt would be doing it ... your Hibs, Hearts and Aberdeen's of this world would easily find an extra couple of million per year and push the boat out but they don't because it's a far-fetched, stupid, utopian, idealist philosophy - what makes us so special that we dive in ignorantly every transfer window and make the same mistakes over and over again and get different results?

It just doesn't work - likewise touring round the other Scottish clubs for guys who's having a good spell like Jones and Docherty - in the long run they won't be any better than Windass, Jack or Holt but again we just keep going down the same routes. 

What's that phrase something about madness isn't making a mistake, it's making the same mistake every time and eventually hoping for a different result? 

So what do you suggest? I see you in many threads complaining about the transfer policy ( mostly with good reason) but seriously you haven't seen any of our targets playing yet write them off due to past mistakes....

 

I assume you were slating Morelos before we signed him because he was playing in the backwaters of Finnish football .

 

Who do you think we should be signing?

Dont be vague now you must have some names you'd like us to go after ....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Birthday card pish its very Warburton and if it was so easy every Club would be able to do it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pedro was the most recent example of the Manager coming in, trashing the joint and bringing in his own guys. It was definitely a mixed bag, even though I would defend the gamble on a guy like Peña and obviously he had success with Morelos and Candeias amongst others. 

Since Allen has come in we've picked up a new left back who has been very good, a development loan from QPR (eh, but it allows squad rotation why not) and a top Championship left winger. 

Sounds like the new system is working so far. In theory it's a much much smarter way of working transfers so excited to see what it produces. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We cant emulate that model, the fact is they play in the EPL where transfer fees are extortionate. They can also bring in some of the best youth players around due to the league and money available for them to speculate on players. We can not do that due to the league and money in the Scottish game.......christ we are already losing players to clubs down south before they have even featured in the first team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, K.A.I said:

It just doesn't work - likewise touring round the other Scottish clubs for guys who's having a good spell like Jones and Docherty - in the long run they won't be any better than Windass, Jack or Holt but again we just keep going down the same routes. 

Can't agree with this at all mate.

For comparisons sake, what's to say Docherty doesn't mature into the next McCarthy or MacArthur? Who both went to England and better things. If we went in for MacArthur now would you be happy with him signing?

Or Jones becoming the next Murphy, who you are happy with.

To me it's about spotting the right players but also having the right people at the club to nurture and improve those players to get the best out out of them before selling on.

There's an argument to be had for signing young hungry players rather than guys who are nearing the end of their careers and on relatively big money because they came back up the road from England.

Or maybe they will end up shite but signing the best of talent from other Scottish clubs is not some new phenomenom, we have always done it, what i will say is that having watched Killie about 4 or 5 times this season and every Rangers game, Jones has already impressed me more than Windass.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't disagree with Murty's point but I hate hearing that we want to try and copy smaller clubs like Southampton. In years gone by they would look to us.

Southampton are a small club able to punch far above their weight due to the riches of the Premier league - we are not going to be able to pay the fees they can regardless of what we do. Unfortunately money talks in football now and has skewed/destroyed the market depending on your perspective. The club we really need to be mirroring in terms of strategy much as it pains me to say it is celtic - their circumstances in terms of tv money available etc far more mirror our own and they have made the model work very well for them in the last few years. 

There is no rocket science to it. All we are really talking about here is having a good scouting network which should be a given for any club, particularly one like ourselves. Our recruitment for years has been woeful and the decimation and quality of our scouring network is criminal. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I remember ally saying we were going to copy the Ajax model... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't object to anything or disagree with anything in that report, except to say that Southampton have had fit for purpose DOF's and we haven't got one who is fit for purpose.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, FSM said:

This model sounds great. Type into the machine "I want a player who can do x, y and z, but he needs to cost no more than 100K and he must not want more than 5K per week in wages". Machine goes whizz, bang, pop and out comes a list of English third division players for us to choose from.

:mutley:You been watching way too many movies

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Smile said:

Birthday card pish its very Warburton and if it was so easy every Club would be able to do it.

yeah it's what we do best at this moment

talk the talk .

I would prefer more walk the walk  . More action and less of the bullshite would be good for starters

In Murphy . Possibly a  start .................................................................

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, DrLaudrup said:

I don't disagree with Murty's point but I hate hearing that we want to try and copy smaller clubs like Southampton. In years gone by they would look to us.

Southampton are a small club able to punch far above their weight due to the riches of the Premier league - we are not going to be able to pay the fees they can regardless of what we do. Unfortunately money talks in football now and has skewed/destroyed the market depending on your perspective. The club we really need to be mirroring in terms of strategy much as it pains me to say it is celtic - their circumstances in terms of tv money available etc far more mirror our own and they have made the model work very well for them in the last few years. 

There is no rocket science to it. All we are really talking about here is having a good scouting network which should be a given for any club, particularly one like ourselves. Our recruitment for years has been woeful and the decimation and quality of our scouring network is criminal. 

The ONLY reason they are in the position they are is not down to good decisions and what not by their board, its simply down to luck.

Its no coincidence their bank balance has gone up by tens of millions since 2012. Before that, sure they had the healthiest bank balance but we could easily compete with them. We also had a similar squad if not better.

After 2012 they had a clear run at 4 titles giving them access to champions league which they manages twice I think. This swelled their coffers by around £40 million or more while also stretching away from the rest of Scottish football in the process..........so no I dont agree, we cant copy thrm as they are simply fortunate due to circumstances, thats not something we can emulate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, OneDavidCooper said:

Don't object to anything or disagree with anything in that report, except to say that Southampton have had fit for purpose DOF's and we haven't got one who is fit for purpose.

2/3 signings this transfer window I'm delighted with. The lad Goss I know nothing about.

What's unfit for purpose about that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Deanzmeanzheinz said:

 

However, and not that I’m glad he signed, but where does a 28yr Jamie Murphy fall into this new policy??? 

“But we have to, in January, have people who can come in and impact our season immediately.”

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Camshy said:

The ONLY reason they are in the position they are is not down to good decisions and what not by their board, its simply down to luck.

Its no coincidence their bank balance has gone up by tens of millions since 2012. Before that, sure they had the healthiest bank balance but we could easily compete with them. We also had a similar squad if not better.

After 2012 they had a clear run at 4 titles giving them access to champions league which they manages twice I think. This swelled their coffers by around £40 million or more while also stretching away from the rest of Scottish football in the process..........so no I dont agree, we cant copy thrm as they are simply fortunate due to circumstances, thats not something we can emulate.

I'd agree with most of that to be honest. I think the difference is how they have spent money. The extreme fortune they have had has allowed them to make mistakes in the transfer market and get away with it as they still have money to spare. Additionally they have been good at buying low and selling high / negotiating sell on clauses etcher players. They artificially inflate the prices of their players but that is because they can. For example in this window, having just got 7.5m from the van Dijk Liverpool deal they don't need to sell anyone - if anyone sniffs around they can name their price pretty much. There is so much money kicking around down south some people are stupid enough to bite. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
46 minutes ago, With Heart and Hand said:

St Mary's Stadium :megaanguish:

Its an Anglican church, like Saint Domingos is Methodist. The taigs dont have sole claim on saints. Its where Southampton get their nickname.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, JograBear said:

I remember ally saying we were going to copy the Ajax model... 

Aye then his first signings were Kevin Kyle & Fran Sandaza :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, RD.1872 said:

Aye then his first signings were Kevin Kyle & Fran Sandaza :lol:

Aye but have you forgotten how mccoist got them playing like Marco Van Basten?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If it's about making money through buying cheap and selling high then you'll never achieve it by buying Scottish players (talking about players going for circa 10 million plus). Scottish players seem to have a value cap placed on them (Alan Hutton or Craig Gordon being very rare exceptions in years gone by). Look at the tims, selling on Dutch, French and Croatian players for large profit. Nobody is offering 10 million plus for any of their Scottish 'talent'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, Sportingintegritymyarse said:

Aye but have you forgotten how mccoist got them playing like Marco Van Basten?

After the leg break?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, plumbGER said:

Can't agree with this at all mate.

For comparisons sake, what's to say Docherty doesn't mature into the next McCarthy or MacArthur? Who both went to England and better things. If we went in for MacArthur now would you be happy with him signing?

Or Jones becoming the next Murphy, who you are happy with.

To me it's about spotting the right players but also having the right people at the club to nurture and improve those players to get the best out out of them before selling on.

There's an argument to be had for signing young hungry players rather than guys who are nearing the end of their careers and on relatively big money because they came back up the road from England.

Or maybe they will end up shite but signing the best of talent from other Scottish clubs is not some new phenomenom, we have always done it, what i will say is that having watched Killie about 4 or 5 times this season and every Rangers game, Jones has already impressed me more than Windass.

Jones can’t bevome the next Murphy because we can’t develop and enhance a player the way teams down south can - if Murphy joined us from Motherwell there’s no way he’d be the player he is today and to say Jones is better than Windass is mental imo 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Orangeclement said:

So what do you suggest? I see you in many threads complaining about the transfer policy ( mostly with good reason) but seriously you haven't seen any of our targets playing yet write them off due to past mistakes....

 

I assume you were slating Morelos before we signed him because he was playing in the backwaters of Finnish football .

 

Who do you think we should be signing?

Dont be vague now you must have some names you'd like us to go after ....

Haha wrong on so many levels - I’ve said loads what I’d suggest - for every 3 O’Hallorans we could afford a Dembele of our own instead of stock piling average players who give us zero return - it’s sbout using the budget wisely 

wrong again on Morelos as I said endless times when we signed him in the summer I was delighted - there’s plenty quotes from me to that effect if you want to use the search function and lastly if you really are such an avid reader of my posts then you wouldn’t need to ask me as I’ve answered it loads but there’s certain markets I’d scout Russia, Serbia, Croatia, Slovakia, Slovenia etc watch those international teams or teams from them countries in Europa league and they can school our teams and the Scottish team 

outwith that I don’t have all the answers but I know for sure what isn’t the answer in regards to winning a title from celtic and that’s signing the jones and Docherty’s of this world some people have alarmingly short memories and incredibly nieve 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, graeme_4 said:

I disagree.

Our successful sides have always had a core of Scottish players developed in our league. 

Being selective about them is key, but not the premise of signing in form players from our league.

Do you really think Jones and Docherty are the next Brown, I.Ferguson, Thomson, Naismith, Goram, McCann etc to use examples of top players we’ve had we’ve signed from Scottish teams?

if the standard was to improve then sure I’d be the first to say be selective and have a look but the state of the Scottish game is so poor none of those players will lay a glove on celtic not one and if we sign these two I’m book marking this thread as I’m sick of making the same mistakes - I heard arguments the exact same as this when signing guys like O’Halloran, Billy King, Ryan Jack etc ... I feel like banging my head off a wall because they are no better than what we’ve got - apparently the Kilmarnock fans want to swap MOH for Jones what does that say?

Whats Ali Crawford or Murray Davidson doing now? Same folk were beating the drums for them on here not long ago too and using the same justifications for wanting them signed. Flash in the pans - let’s get real talent like Walker in who can enhance the XI and don’t cost the world 

that goes to Compton above too not typing same reply out twice 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×