Gio Discussion Thread

[Colin Traive 23,931]

1 hour ago, Smell the hotdog said:

Katic on a different planet if he thinks he was good enough for us. Did he really think his spell before his injury and average spell back in Croatia merited him staying?

We all knew Katic time was done, all apart from himself by looks of it.

Don’t think that many are arguing that Katic was ever going to be the long term solution but, with Helander (permanently) unavailable, Souttar unavailable and Davies unavailable, you have to question if the correct answer to this:

”How do we manage in defence now?”

is…

”Let’s chuck away an experienced, committed centre back who is good in the air and rely on a 21 year old American midfielder and an inexperienced 18 year old.”

Looks foolish, short sighted and bloody minded. He could even have been retained until January window in the hope that Davies (probable), Souttar (fuck knows) or Helander (no laughing at the back) will be fit and ready to play.

Give me an average player with the right attitude over a more gifted guy who is hardly ever fit/in the mood/available every day of the week.

As much as we’re not happy with the team right now, I sense that Gio is pretty disenchanted too.

[BlueSuedeSambas 56,482]

15 minutes ago, .Williamson. said:

How do you put that scrutiny across though? Gio is the man doing the press conferences and standing on the touchline in games. Ross Wilson is nowhere to be seen unless a signing has been made or we have been successful

Yeah that’s the problem. Short of protests outside the ground calling for Wilson’s removal it’s difficult to find a platform to call for change. 

[BlueSuedeSambas 56,482]

17 minutes ago, MadSasa said:

Don’t like the whole Head coach/DOF set up. Get a manager who signs and picks the players he wants to a style he likes. 

What do you do when that manager leaves and takes his entire staff and most of the club’s footballing infrastructure with him though? 

Most clubs have some form of infrastructure where there’s a DOF/Sporting Director these days.
 

Rightly or wrongly, it’s the modern way. 

[SeparateEntityMyArse 55,462]

21 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

If that’s the case then there needs to be more scrutiny made of Wilson’s poor recruitment. He gets some criticism online, but nowhere near as much as Gio does. 

It's all guesswork, there needs to be clarity. If Gio IS catching blame for recruitment that's not his then he needs to state its not in his remit. He's got fuck all to lose by doing so, his job is already on the line. Regardless if he's been told not to by Wilson or anyone else.

I'd love to think Boyd has been teed up to raise the point, but I think he's just as exasperated as the rest of us and wants answers and clarification.

[MadSasa 245]

6 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

What do you do when that manager leaves and takes his entire staff and most of the club’s footballing infrastructure with him though? 

Most clubs have some form of infrastructure where there’s a DOF/Sporting Director these days.
 

Rightly or wrongly, it’s the modern way. 

I suppose you could have the DOF/Sporting Director dealing with renewing contracts, helping with scouting and budgets but ultimately the manager has the final say in who he signs. Don’t think we’ll ever know how much control Gio has but it does seem like Ross Wilson is the one pulling the strings, I’m inclined to agree with Boyd though and think Gio is just a head coach. 

[magic8ball 27,904]

25 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

What do you do when that manager leaves and takes his entire staff and most of the club’s footballing infrastructure with him though? 

Most clubs have some form of infrastructure where there’s a DOF/Sporting Director these days.
 

Rightly or wrongly, it’s the modern way. 

It’s like the one up top striker system that started 15 or so years ago .We couldn’t get our heads round that so we thought it was wrong .

Now most of us are comfortable with that and see what the benefit can be .
 

Majority of us understand the old role of a manager far better than the new system of first team coach and DOF .
 

Im sure I’m time we will get our heads round the system .On the plus our current DOF is better than the cunt we had that ran bus company for a living 😉

[BlueKnight87 17,908]

30 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

What do you do when that manager leaves and takes his entire staff and most of the club’s footballing infrastructure with him though? 

Most clubs have some form of infrastructure where there’s a DOF/Sporting Director these days.
 

Rightly or wrongly, it’s the modern way. 

It is the modern approach but it can be implemented differently. 

The more successful approach is a DOF that supports the manager, helps get the players manager wants, handles renewal and sales etc.

If Wilson is just dictating then we're in even more trouble. His recruitment is a shambles. I do remember as well rumours when Gerrard left that Wilson wanted more control but couldn't get it while Gerrard was there. 

[esquire8 45,376]

1 hour ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

What do you do when that manager leaves and takes his entire staff and most of the club’s footballing infrastructure with him though? 

Most clubs have some form of infrastructure where there’s a DOF/Sporting Director these days.
 

Rightly or wrongly, it’s the modern way. 

If Gio leaves the entire backroom staff go with him too. Then you're left with a infrastructure built by incompetence anyway. 

You'd understand having a DoF/Sporting Director if he was better at his job than any manager we could hire could do. 

Right now our Sporting Director is making a mess of the place anyway.

[Smell the hotdog 4,129]

1 hour ago, Colin Traive said:

Don’t think that many are arguing that Katic was ever going to be the long term solution but, with Helander (permanently) unavailable, Souttar unavailable and Davies unavailable, you have to question if the correct answer to this:

”How do we manage in defence now?”

is…

”Let’s chuck away an experienced, committed centre back who is good in the air and rely on a 21 year old American midfielder and an inexperienced 18 year old.”

Looks foolish, short sighted and bloody minded. He could even have been retained until January window in the hope that Davies (probable), Souttar (fuck knows) or Helander (no laughing at the back) will be fit and ready to play.

Give me an average player with the right attitude over a more gifted guy who is hardly ever fit/in the mood/available every day of the week.

As much as we’re not happy with the team right now, I sense that Gio is pretty disenchanted too.

He had 12 month on his deal, you can’t carry 7 centre backs in a squad it’s fuckin mental. We recouped as much as we could for him and got him off the wage bill it was the right decision.

Again, for some reason this season we have people wanting to hoard players ie Katic or sign old ones ie Balogun when Davies is back on the bench, King needs a pathway. Players get injured, it happens we need to deal with it.

Long and short of it, sands has been as good as if not better than Goldson this season. Goldson and Tav you should be looking at never mind two young players.

[RoboBearToo 403]

Like a lot of us I know a good few people who support celtic. Before Gio came they were saying he was capable of getting a much bigger club than us and were clearly worried when he did sign.

Just as most if not all of us were over the moon when he agreed to come.

However it's not gone as we hoped and they feared.

I think Gio is a better manager than he's been able to show. So we either need to change the system or find a manager who can thrive in the system that we currently have.

I think it would be best for both parties if Gio was to move on, but I haven't realy got any idea who should come in.

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,639]

2 hours ago, Colin Traive said:

Don’t think that many are arguing that Katic was ever going to be the long term solution but, with Helander (permanently) unavailable, Souttar unavailable and Davies unavailable, you have to question if the correct answer to this:

”How do we manage in defence now?”

is…

”Let’s chuck away an experienced, committed centre back who is good in the air and rely on a 21 year old American midfielder and an inexperienced 18 year old.”

Looks foolish, short sighted and bloody minded. He could even have been retained until January window in the hope that Davies (probable), Souttar (fuck knows) or Helander (no laughing at the back) will be fit and ready to play.

Give me an average player with the right attitude over a more gifted guy who is hardly ever fit/in the mood/available every day of the week.

As much as we’re not happy with the team right now, I sense that Gio is pretty disenchanted too.

When katic was told he could go, both davies and souttar were fit and available, granted some of us knew the script that souttar was gonna follow injury wise,

[Laudrupsleftfoot 12,320]

3 hours ago, .Williamson. said:

Think Boyd makes a fair point regarding Gio not having much of a say in terms of recruitment and the fact there’s no Dutch players speaks volumes on that front, but the structure is not going to change. 

Just to explore this a bit - so if we brought in say Rebrov we'd be expecting Ukrainian or Hungarian players being brought in?

I'm not saying you're wrong about the point you're making, but the balance between a Dutch player being good enough for us (i.e. a player the 'big 3' would be interested in) and affordable is a delicate one.

[KeyserSoze 15,298]

3 hours ago, .Williamson. said:

Think Boyd makes a fair point regarding Gio not having much of a say in terms of recruitment and the fact there’s no Dutch players speaks volumes on that front, but the structure is not going to change. 

Crazy to think Gio doesn’t have a say in the players he has to work with and that fit his style of play. 
 

ffs 😀

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,639]

2 hours ago, SeparateEntityMyArse said:

It's all guesswork, there needs to be clarity. If Gio IS catching blame for recruitment that's not his then he needs to state its not in his remit. He's got fuck all to lose by doing so, his job is already on the line. Regardless if he's been told not to by Wilson or anyone else.

I'd love to think Boyd has been teed up to raise the point, but I think he's just as exasperated as the rest of us and wants answers and clarification.

Theres probably a mix of both to blame, gio and his staff will identify positions needing bolstered, and indicate to Wilson and the scouting team what atrributes we are looking for in these positions

The scouts then come back with a list of players, probably in order of the potential best fit 

Wilson/scouts show them to gio, he might or might not check the players out himself a bit and identify the ones he prefers, then wilson looks and finds if they are within our budget

As much as we made good money in europe and sold a fair whack, i have a feeling our accounts are gonna show it still a bit tight financially, hence the reservations to go spend utter fortunes

Can see our wage bill being the choker for us

[BlueKnight87 17,908]

22 minutes ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

Just to explore this a bit - so if we brought in say Rebrov we'd be expecting Ukrainian or Hungarian players being brought in?

I'm not saying you're wrong about the point you're making, but the balance between a Dutch player being good enough for us (i.e. a player the 'big 3' would be interested in) and affordable is a delicate one.

It doesn't have to be Dutch national players exclusively. I would have thought gio and his coaches would have some ideas of players in the eredivisie that could improve the side. 

A lot of managers tend to look at leagues or setups they have experience of for players. 

Perhaps we did look and decided against it. But still it's interesting not a single player from a league or setup gio has had involvement in has come in. 

[Laudrupsleftfoot 12,320]

1 minute ago, BlueKnight87 said:

It doesn't have to be Dutch national players exclusively. I would have thought gio and his coaches would have some ideas of players in the eredivisie that could improve the side. 

A lot of managers tend to look at leagues or setups they have experience of for players. 

Perhaps we did look and decided against it. But still it's interesting not a single player from a league or setup gio has had involvement in has come in. 

I think it goes back to the point about both good enough and affordable.

We want to find that player who is on the cusp of a move to Ajax or PSV, like Berghuis a couple of years ago when he looked good against us for Feyenoord, and Veerman more recently (although I don't think he's that good).

I don't know Dutch football well so maybe there are a lot of players like that, I suspect the ones who are good enough for us are just often slightly out of our reach financially.

[johanhentze 14,779]

3 hours ago, MadSasa said:

Don’t like the whole Head coach/DOF set up. Get a manager who signs and picks the players he wants to a style he likes. 

The setup works if you get coaches in that have similar styles, but I just dont see the similarity between Gerrard and Gio.

[BlueSuedeSambas 56,482]

35 minutes ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

I think it goes back to the point about both good enough and affordable.

We want to find that player who is on the cusp of a move to Ajax or PSV, like Berghuis a couple of years ago when he looked good against us for Feyenoord, and Veerman more recently (although I don't think he's that good).

I don't know Dutch football well so maybe there are a lot of players like that, I suspect the ones who are good enough for us are just often slightly out of our reach financially.

You are never quite sure are you? There were a few AZ players who looked class against Dundee Utd but I don’t even know if a player playing for them would be beyond us financially these days or not. You would like think they wouldn’t be, but who knows.

[AGM_72 4,081]

1 minute ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

You are never quite sure are you? There were a few AZ players who looked class against Dundee Utd but I don’t even know if a player playing for them would be beyond us financially these days or not. You would like think they wouldn’t be, but who knows.

Their striker was signed for 2.5m from VVV Venlo after one good season, nothing standing out too much prior. But I tend to agree, there's often doubt about anyone who hasn't already been snapped up by Ajax or PSV or at the very least been linked with them.

[MadSasa 245]

17 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

You are never quite sure are you? There were a few AZ players who looked class against Dundee Utd but I don’t even know if a player playing for them would be beyond us financially these days or not. You would like think they wouldn’t be, but who knows.

Always said we should be exploiting the Balkan and Eastern European markets they are usually not as overpriced as some leagues.

[BlueSuedeSambas 56,482]

13 minutes ago, AGM_72 said:

Their striker was signed for 2.5m from VVV Venlo after one good season, nothing standing out too much prior. But I tend to agree, there's often doubt about anyone who hasn't already been snapped up by Ajax or PSV or at the very least been linked with them.

De Wit looked good too.

[AGM_72 4,081]

7 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

De Wit looked good too.

Made that sound like I meant the AZ striker (who was good in that second leg), actually meant Giakoumakis haha. It's interesting to compare the two though, AZ's striker is younger and has a better record at this stage in his career.

[nik2402 1,586]

1 hour ago, johanvanhentze said:

The setup works if you get coaches in that have similar styles, but I just dont see the similarity between Gerrard and Gio.

They both play slow defensive football. 

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,639]

56 minutes ago, nik2402 said:

They both play slow defensive football. 

As much as gio is struggling the now, people are having some form of memory loss with regards to how shite the football was at times under gerrard 

In gerrards 3 seasons we averaged just over 2 goals a game first 2 seasons and then 2.5 goals a game in the title winning season, 

Both last season and this current season we are averaging the same goals ratio as gerrards first 2, 

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