graeme_4’s official Clement discussion thread

[Prso's headband 36,846]

3 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

Has Clement lost the dressing room? when he first came in players were pressing high up the park and there was clearly less sideways and backwards passing, is he instructing them to play differently now or are players no longer following instructions? 

There’s definitely something in this. There is no way we go from the way we were from November to March then April to now and something hasn’t changed. 
 

Players getting told contracts weren’t being renewed is a factor. 
 

The other factor I still think has had a lasting effect is the management hasn’t been given half of what he was promised last year. I honestly think that’s a huge reason why we’re in this position. His whole demeanour has changed in the last 6 months compared to the first 6. He gives off a cba attitude at times and quite clearly is coming out with a pile of nonsense knowing the only option is to sack him. 
 

I don’t think he’s realised quite how much it means to win and that’s had an effect but broken promises are definitely a reason 

[Laudrupsleftfoot 12,396]

8 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

What are the minor details? we were knocked out the CL qualifiers by a dug shite Kiev side. 
 

We dropped points to an atrocious Hearts team on the opening day.

 

We were predictably battered by the tarriers again under Clement.

 

Beaten at home by a bang average Lyon side. 
 

Baffling team selections/ substitutions/ glaring holes in the squad he has failed to address.

Horrific tactics and lack of a style of play.

what are the “minor details” here as I’m not seeing any. 

Simmer down.

I’m not saying the issues are just minor details.

Like Beale he’s at a point now where many if not most will take issue with every word coming out of his mouth.

[RossS1873 2,719]

It's amazing that people will use the "Lyon spent 120 million" excuse when St Johnstone play us off the park on Sunday. The guy clearly has proven, he has absolutely no idea how to fix this. A complete dud who admittedly, had to make big decisions to get rid of players, but can't manage a football team which is the main aspect of his job. You could get 11 guys from the stand who could play a game more organised than what Clement is dishing out. And as with every single other manager, the persistence with Tavernier will cost him his job, at least before you'd get a few screamers and the odd free kick, we aren't getting anything now.

[BlueSuedeSambas 56,561]

5 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

Beaten at home by a bang average Lyon side.

People keep saying this and I just don’t fully agree with it at all.

They started with Cherki, Lacazette & Fofana, who are a level above, and they could have subbed on Zaha, Mikautadze & Benrahma, who are also a level above anything we have.

We clearly made mistakes which made it harder for ourselves, but sometimes you come up against sides who have more quality and they punish you and that’s ultimately what happened.

[KingKirk 26,529]

Anyone that thinks removing the manager will lead to someone better coming in isn't living in the real world.  If Clement goes it will be someone like Alex Neil who will replace him. Nobody with any standing in the game would give us a second thought. Am no even sure a McInnes takes it either tbh

[nik2402 1,588]

More and more people realising what Clement really is. Been saying for months it would make no difference who the players are with the tactics and formation Clement uses.

His answer to 4Lads question was embarrassing and up there with his remarks about the Ross County win after the celtic defeat. 
 

It’s a matter of when and not if he goes. Just going to be the save cycle whilst he’s here. Win majority of domestic games but fail when the tests come. Dont have faith we go to Aberdeen and Killie next month and win. 

[6superbarry6 14,663]

6 minutes ago, Prso's headband said:

There’s definitely something in this. There is no way we go from the way we were from November to March then April to now and something hasn’t changed. 
 

Players getting told contracts weren’t being renewed is a factor. 
 

The other factor I still think has had a lasting effect is the management hasn’t been given half of what he was promised last year. I honestly think that’s a huge reason why we’re in this position. His whole demeanour has changed in the last 6 months compared to the first 6. He gives off a cba attitude at times and quite clearly is coming out with a pile of nonsense knowing the only option is to sack him. 
 

I don’t think he’s realised quite how much it means to win and that’s had an effect but broken promises are definitely a reason 

The drop off since Easter last year is mental there has to be more to it. 

[6superbarry6 14,663]

5 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

People keep saying this and I just don’t fully agree with it at all.

They started with Cherki, Lacazette & Fofana, who are a level above, and they could have subbed on Zaha, Mikautadze & Benrahma, who are also a level above anything we have.

We clearly made mistakes which made it harder for ourselves, but sometimes you come up against sides who have more quality and they punish you and that’s ultimately what happened.

Their front 3 was pretty decent (nothing special) think the rest of their side especially the defence is piss poor though. 

[superallysbears 8,287]

Lyon were decent but I think we were well below what we could have produced and that's down to the manager.

[STEPPS BOY 77,810]

13 minutes ago, KingKirk said:

Anyone that thinks removing the manager will lead to someone better coming in isn't living in the real world.  If Clement goes it will be someone like Alex Neil who will replace him. Nobody with any standing in the game would give us a second thought. Am no even sure a McInnes takes it either tbh

Nonsense.

Managers in general are egotistical. 
 

There would be a queue round the block to take job on. Our ability to choose right one is the issue.

[STEPPS BOY 77,810]

10 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

Their front 3 was pretty decent (nothing special) think the rest of their side especially the defence is piss poor though. 

Cherki and Fofana look absolutely class.

[bluenoz 32,666]

Lyon were there for the taking early on until we started missing chances and making mistakes. In the end, we made them look much better than they are.

That's not how you set up in European football. We played like schoolboys out there.

 

[J-Maestro 14,027]

As much as I think some of the criticism isn't bordering on reality, I don't really think he should get much praise for the good signings either. He said himself he prefers coaching to the identifying and signing players so that will be mostly down to Koppen.

[6superbarry6 14,663]

2 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

Cherki and Fofana look absolutely class.

What did Fofana do once Tav went off? Kasanwirjo handled him with ease albeit for a short time, Jefte I will give more leeway than Tav as he’s a young lad still learning at this level, we really should’ve ditched the 10 and went a flat 3 in the middle to offer more protection 

[AGM_72 4,093]

19 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

People keep saying this and I just don’t fully agree with it at all.

They started with Cherki, Lacazette & Fofana, who are a level above, and they could have subbed on Zaha, Mikautadze & Benrahma, who are also a level above anything we have.

We clearly made mistakes which made it harder for ourselves, but sometimes you come up against sides who have more quality and they punish you and that’s ultimately what happened.

If Benrahma or Zaha signed for us they'd be the best players in the league, nevermind our club. 

I do think there's an element of truth to the fact Lyon aren't great in the middle or at the back, but people are maybe judging them as if we have a squad drilled like we did under Gerrard - not the mess we have now. 

[Laudrupsleftfoot 12,396]

5 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said:

Nonsense.

Managers in general are egotistical. 
 

There would be a queue round the block to take job on. Our ability to choose right one is the issue.

To be fair we say this every time and yet invariably the options are never great.

[J-Maestro 14,027]

2 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

What did Fofana do once Tav went off? Kasanwirjo handled him with ease albeit for a short time, Jefte I will give more leeway than Tav as he’s a young lad still learning at this level, we really should’ve ditched the 10 and went a flat 3 in the middle to offer more protection 

There's also the likelihood they took the foot off the gas a bit at 4-1. 

[6superbarry6 14,663]

1 minute ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

To be fair we say this every time and yet invariably the options are never great.

We don’t know all of the options though? apparently Glasner was interested last time around and was dismissed by the board, apparently Faraoil wanted the job when appointed Beale.

[McEwan's Lager 32,124]

19 minutes ago, BlueSuedeSambas said:

People keep saying this and I just don’t fully agree with it at all.

They started with Cherki, Lacazette & Fofana, who are a level above, and they could have subbed on Zaha, Mikautadze & Benrahma, who are also a level above anything we have.

We clearly made mistakes which made it harder for ourselves, but sometimes you come up against sides who have more quality and they punish you and that’s ultimately what happened.

Tolisso has never been the same since his ACL, but he's still a good player with a Champions League and a World Cup winners medal. Tagliafico, another World Cup winner.

Matic, again, past his best but still decent and has played at a higher level than anyone else in our squad. Caqueret is a classy player, he was great against us back in 2021 and he had a decent game again last night.

Squad was stacked with quality players. 

[SuperLeeMcCulloch 2,502]

3 minutes ago, superallysbears said:

Lyon were decent but I think we were well below what we could have produced and that's down to the manager.

Think most fans are realistic enough to accept a better quality side beating you, its the fact every time we come up against a decent side we gift them least 2 goals, I don't care about budgets doing the basics of the game should be the absolute minimum requirement and is something we make a mess of most games.

[Blue72 1,237]

2 hours ago, DrLaudrup said:

You might get a new manager bounce but unless the issues with the board, finances, scouting etc are sorted we will be in the same situation again. I feel we can’t continually be changing managers and having to make large payouts. If someone came in for him and we were compensated I would be ok with that but we are just throwing money away. 

Yeah I think it’s probably better we stick with clement, accept that we’re unlikely to run the league close anyway (really can’t see it with our squad no matter who the manager) then make the call in early spring 24 and get someone in if things continue to be poor 

managerial merry go round is expensive and is certainly not bringing us success! 

[RockwellGers 15,382]

34 minutes ago, Laudrupsleftfoot said:

Simmer down.

[Blue72 1,237]

In Clement’s defence and It’s only one stat but out xG was higher than Lyon’s - definitely didn’t feel that way after the first 30 mins anyway.

so often even when we’re poor we have 2-3 great chances.  Clement needs to figure out how to coach the front line to put these away, it’s like a psychological barrier.  Dessers constantly taking four touches and the chance is up. 
 

that said recent form against Hibs for instance I can’t recall us even having more than a few half chances.

agree with comment above I think he was promised funds that didn’t materialise (possibly partly due to cost of hampden) and possibly because we couldn’t get fees for a number of players.  The team look unfit/lacking energy, and at times disinterested.  

[bluenoz 32,666]

I've never seen a player like Diomande so exposed. Barron plays off the CBs. Tracking back defensively is not Lawrence's strong point. This leaves Diomande up against 2, sometimes 3 midfielders. 

If you play with one striker, he has to be lethal and have the ability to hold the ball up. Dessers is not that player. He needs someone closer to him

The current formation is not working, and it needs to be changed. I'm not sure how Clement can't see this. It's glaringly obvious.

[STEPPS BOY 77,810]

25 minutes ago, 6superbarry6 said:

What did Fofana do once Tav went off? Kasanwirjo handled him with ease albeit for a short time, Jefte I will give more leeway than Tav as he’s a young lad still learning at this level, we really should’ve ditched the 10 and went a flat 3 in the middle to offer more protection 

The game was done. They were in training mode.