ForeverAndEver 72,121 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Yes, I think it"s close to the stage of me hating him. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamess 3,453 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 I'm surprised by the numbers that want to give him more time. I just don't see him being the answer, and the longer we duck the inevitable, the less time a replacement has to turn things round. Needs done well before the January transfer window or I just see another wasted season. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Just now, K.A.I said: I just feel the proof is in the pudding. There's no enough coming through to a decent standard IMO. Each of the past 3 years he's been here we've ended up saying next batch, next batch, next batch ... he can't seem to refine them and polish them and put them into the first team as first team ready players. Was told only the other week the focus is now on the next lot of 16's which seems to be the default standpoint. He's only been Academy boss since Jan 2015. The current group of 20s were almost all in the system before he took over. The current 16s group will be first one really who will have been through the whole/majority of the 'elite' set-up under his watch. Can't really blame the guy for lads who have been in the system 5,6,7 years not being good enough. Not to mention, the whole 'polish' thing is precisely the reason they've pushed this academy games stuff and want a Colt team in the league. There's a huge drop-off in Scotland from 16/17 years old as it becomes much tougher to get kids playing in a competitive environment. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gman36 3,456 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Sam Allardyce please... Please... We're fucking due a turn. Allerdyce and a reasonable transfer kitty and we'd be challenging those scummy fucks. Bad Robot 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Just now, The Dude said: He's only been Academy boss since Jan 2015. The current group of 20s were almost all in the system before he took over. The current 16s group will be first one really who will have been through the whole/majority of the 'elite' set-up under his watch. Can't really blame the guy for lads who have been in the system 5,6,7 years not being good enough. Not to mention, the whole 'polish' thing is precisely the reason they've pushed this academy games stuff and want a Colt team in the league. There's a huge drop-off in Scotland from 16/17 years old as it becomes much tougher to get kids playing in a competitive environment. OK almost 2 years and 10 months then not 3-years. But it comes down to your perspective and the faith you've got. What happens if this batch of 16's in a couple of years aren't upto scratch that's 5-years down the man when the warning signs were possibly there but just dismissed. People talk about not wanting to keep rebuilding with the first team and keeping someone who's a crap manager in Pedro in a job but there's something similar going on in the unders too - the wrong people in charge but too scared to change it (or maybe can't afford to change it) That's why and I'm sure you'll agree it's important to get these decisions right first time. Scotland is it's own worst enemy - at the Rangers U20's vs Dumbarton game I was told not many Dumbarton fans will be coming out, I asked why and I was told that their fans along with most others are totally against the premier league teams putting colt teams into their competition which is a shame as it's great for development, it's competitive and raises the profile and money with some half decent crowds. Or should. But as usual it's Scottish football being Scottish football. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEPPS BOY 75,033 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us. Damning. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Just now, K.A.I said: OK almost 2 years and 10 months then not 3-years. But it comes down to your perspective and the faith you've got. What happens if this batch of 16's in a couple of years aren't upto scratch that's 5-years down the man when the warning signs were possibly there but just dismissed. People talk about not wanting to keep rebuilding with the first team and keeping someone who's a crap manager in Pedro in a job but there's something similar going on in the unders too - the wrong people in charge but too scared to change it (or maybe can't afford to change it) That's why and I'm sure you'll agree it's important to get these decisions right first time. Scotland is it's own worst enemy - at the Rangers U20's vs Dumbarton game I was told not many Dumbarton fans will be coming out, I asked why and I was told that their fans along with most others are totally against the premier league teams putting colt teams into their competition which is a shame as it's great for development, it's competitive and raises the profile and money with some half decent crowds. Or should. But as usual it's Scottish football being Scottish football. That's the very nature of youth development though. There have been plenty of boys who were world beaters at 14,15,16 that by the time they were 20 were working as brickies due to their own actions (or lack thereof). Christ, across his entire time at Man United Ferguson had something like one kid every other season (on average) who came through and made more than 50 appearances for them, and that includes the 'Class of 92' lot and this was at a time when there were far less foreigners in British football. Ajax are the masters of it but it took them years to get the right set-up in place. It's far from an overnight fix. The English do the same with U23s being involved in the EFL Trophy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, The Dude said: That's the very nature of youth development though. There have been plenty of boys who were world beaters at 14,15,16 that by the time they were 20 were working as brickies due to their own actions (or lack thereof). Christ, across his entire time at Man United Ferguson had something like one kid every other season (on average) who came through and made more than 50 appearances for them, and that includes the 'Class of 92' lot and this was at a time when there were far less foreigners in British football. Ajax are the masters of it but it took them years to get the right set-up in place. It's far from an overnight fix. The English do the same with U23s being involved in the EFL Trophy. I know but celtic have had Forrest, McGregor, Tierny, Ralston all come through in the last what 5 for Forrest and couple of years for the rest. If they can do it, we should be able to, too. We put a lot of money and resources into our academy it's not unrealistic to expect some players. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude 20,026 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Just now, K.A.I said: I know but celtic have had Forrest, McGregor, Tierny, Ralston all come through in the last what 5 for Forrest and couple of years for the rest. If they can do it, we should be able to, too. We put a lot of money and resources into our academy it's not unrealistic to expect some players. Not sure if you've noticed or not but we've kinda been in the grubber the last five years. IIrc, they MASSIVELY outspend us on the academy side of things just now and have done for a good few years. I suppose that's helped by having a free run at the CL money for five years while we slit our own throat and begged to be sent down to the third division. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brown Brogues 223 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 26 minutes ago, K.A.I said: and that there is a MASSIVE improvement in where we're at just now, which is all I'm saying. Yes but for how long? If we are a convincing 2nd this year, we will probably expect the title sooner rather than later. I just dont think Rangers as a club can win the title with our current structure. Its a depressing thought. I just feel deflated by it all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, The Dude said: Not sure if you've noticed or not but we've kinda been in the grubber the last five years. IIrc, they MASSIVELY outspend us on the academy side of things just now and have done for a good few years. I suppose that's helped by having a free run at the CL money for five years while we slit our own throat and begged to be sent down to the third division. Oh i've noticed - which makes all the hot air rhetoric from them even more gaulling. We will never agree on this, you have always thought we've done great work there with Mulholland and I simply don't. Time will tell if I'm correct or if I'm being unfair or if it's something in between both of our thoughts. But I've booked for Mechelen and Alkmaar and I'm about to book Benfica for Monday after the cup final so I'll still go and support the boys and see if any of them can change my mind. Anyway I'm away out to run ma daily 9k and shake some of this rage from today, I'll pick up your response when I get back The Dude 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
K.A.I 36,183 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, Brown Brogues said: Yes but for how long? If we are a convincing 2nd this year, we will probably expect the title sooner rather than later. I just dont think Rangers as a club can win the title with our current structure. Its a depressing thought. I just feel deflated by it all. I agree we can't win the title under this current structure but we could be achieving more in other areas, todays celtic game was a pathetic display but it's brought the question of Pedro to a head again as this was his chance to redeem and put the bad memories to bad but alas the nightmare continues Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toad 320 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Unfortunately football development is an extremely tough subject to make a call on. There are some youngsters who excel compared to others at an early age but when they hit a certain age they just don't seem to be able to progress further. It's a really complex subject to determine success as there are so many variables such as physical capabilities, desire, focus, willingness to learn etc etc when dealing with developing kids through to young adults. So many kids also loose focus or get turned away and don't return to the game and it is such a difficult area to judge success. It s also a protracted process across a number of years but I must admit we as a club don't seem to get as many through as we would like. I suppose it is even more difficult at Rangers though as youngsters normally have to be exceptional to get through to the first team and stay there, due to the demands we as a support place on them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Avenger 22,567 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, K.A.I said: I agree we can't win the title under this current structure but we could be achieving more in other areas, todays celtic game was a pathetic display but it's brought the question of Pedro to a head again as this was his chance to redeem and put the bad memories to bad but alas the nightmare continues No one could redeem themselves against the scum with such a gap in quality. We are not at the taces and never will be under any manager whilst this board remain in power. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boaby Bear 411 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 I want him gone but he will still be here come next summer. Nothing against the guy but he is tactically inept at this level. We don't have the time to give a foreign manager the space needed to cut his teeth. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
harlands plater 17,056 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 34 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said: 3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us. Damning. And a better manager than us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJFC 2004 32 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 4 hours ago, simplythebest said: The second half surrender is unforgivable for me To put it simply they absolutely toyed with us in the second half. As I have said a few times before should not have survived our most embarrassing result in Europe and should never have been given the job in the first place. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
saltire266 502 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, K.A.I said: Oh i've noticed - which makes all the hot air rhetoric from them even more gaulling. We will never agree on this, you have always thought we've done great work there with Mulholland and I simply don't. Time will tell if I'm correct or if I'm being unfair or if it's something in between both of our thoughts. But I've booked for Mechelen and Alkmaar and I'm about to book Benfica for Monday after the cup final so I'll still go and support the boys and see if any of them can change my mind. Anyway I'm away out to run ma daily 9k and shake some of this rage from today, I'll pick up your response when I get back What about the boy Atakayi? Surely better than Windass and plenty of pace.The boy Houston at RB gets good reviews also? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the brown brogue 1,934 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 39 minutes ago, STEPPS BOY said: 3 points behind St Johnstone and they have a better goal difference than us. Damning. Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritchieshearercaldow 22,242 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 Up till now the poll shows Pedro should be given more time, if anyone on the board are looking in that's all they need to see. I have no confidence in Pedro or the majority of his signings but realistically we are stuck with him, the board will give him the season, who knows we might just make second an improvement on last season and that will do for the board, anything less and he should go. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boaby Bear 411 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, the brown brogue said: Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top. Fucking depressing reading that fuck me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ritchieshearercaldow 22,242 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, the brown brogue said: Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top. Hivs have still to play them though and they'll just roll over or the scum will gift them a point, in the scheme of things it's going to be hard for any team to take 3 points off them, someone needs to though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STEPPS BOY 75,033 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 11 minutes ago, the brown brogue said: Not to mention a point behind fucking hibs, Motherwell win tomorrow and we're in 6th place and 7 games in we're closer to the bottom of the league than the top. I used St Johnstone because they've also played the taigs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Courtyard Bear 41,357 Posted September 23, 2017 Popular Post Share Posted September 23, 2017 Aye let’s sack this one and get another in then sack him and get another one in and sack him and get another one in. The onwership of our club is the problem when the support wake up to this fact we might move forward. Blue Avenger, IpswichGer, SIRB_72 and 2 others 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandhi1872 186 Posted September 23, 2017 Share Posted September 23, 2017 1 hour ago, K.A.I said: I just feel the proof is in the pudding. There's no enough coming through to a decent standard IMO. Each of the past 3 years he's been here we've ended up saying next batch, next batch, next batch ... he can't seem to refine them and polish them and put them into the first team as first team ready players. Was told only the other week the focus is now on the next lot of 16's which seems to be the default standpoint. McCrorie, A Wilson and Barjonas all look good prospects from what I’ve seen and why should try and get them in the team when the chance arises. A Wilson and Barjonas should be playing before the likes of Danny Wilson and Jason Holt and it’s only through playing that they will improve and cement themselves in the first team. Arguably this is the time when we should be pitching youngsters in as the league looks unlikely. I think Mulholland has done a good job implementing the games against foreign opponents too. I was very impressed with the calibre of teams they’ve managed to arrange fixtures against. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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