Club 1872 Statement

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

5 hours ago, Jimbeamjunior said:

A lot of the fans want more money spent on the team, just because the majority of rank and file fans want something doesnt mean its good for the club

So having the majority rank and file making business decisions is an absolutely frightening thought 

From memory, so very happy to be corrected on this plus I haven't looked a club1872's site since the very first started up and I was considering on whether to join or not, C72's plans were to get the club breaking even at worst should they get in position to be able to call the shots. 

I fully understand your concern as any right minded Rangers fan would, we do not ever want to see any type of repeat of what happened in 2012.

If you want to do something about it, I would suggest joing C72, as I think they work on a 1 member 1 vote system regardless of how many shares you hold. 

I think I will now join as it is definitely looking like they will be the largest shareholder.  

I thought it was just a pipe dream when they first started so never bothered joining, but you need to hand it to them. They done it, and done it quickly.  So it does appear that they are smart enough to not just get a hold of the wheel and steer us straight into a ditch.

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

4 minutes ago, TMB said:

I’d like to buy a share in Rangers but not sure I’d do it through Club 1872.  

They aren't on the stock market anymore mate, so unless you personally know someone who is willing to sell their shares, I don't think there's any chance of buying shares. 

Or you could always put up a thread on all of the Rangers forums and ask if anyone is selling? Its coming up for Christmas,  so might be one or 2 people wanting to sell theirs.

[eastwoodbear 94]

14 minutes ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

Surely that is Club1872's problem then? 

Also, I remember from when I was considering joining club1872 when they first started up that their goal (like I mentioned above) was to buy every share that becomes available in the hope of one day being the largest shareholders. 

I'm not part of club1872, but I don't see how or why that would be a problem (not asking the shareholders) as from day one they have said they will buy every available share as and when the become available in the hope of becoming a fan owned club and by pulling this off so quickly (relatively speaking of course) is quite an achievement. 

I wouldn't trust them with £13 never mind £13m. 

The lack of communication is worrying 

There hasn't been an AGM since 2018 and I don't know when the last audit took place. 

The first members knew of this deal was in the general posts on the Web. 

The next official contact was an email "Here's the deal, how do you want to pay?" 

[LochendBilly 8,413]

2 minutes ago, eastwoodbear said:

I wouldn't trust them with £13 never mind £13m. 

The lack of communication is worrying 

There hasn't been an AGM since 2018 and I don't know when the last audit took place. 

The first members knew of this deal was in the general posts on the Web. 

The next official contact was an email "Here's the deal, how do you want to pay?" 

Not good eh?

[TMB 14,167]

2 minutes ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

They aren't on the stock market anymore mate, so unless you personally know someone who is willing to sell their shares, I don't think there's any chance of buying shares. 

Or you could always put up a thread on all of the Rangers forums and ask if anyone is selling? Its coming up for Christmas,  so might be one or 2 people wanting to sell theirs.

Yeah, I know it’s not a PLC being traded on the stock market.  I’d rather wait until it was a PLC and buy my own share.  Giving money to Club 1872 so they can speak for me isn’t something I’d be interested in.  But, I do hope they’re successful with this as I’d like to see them get a controlling stake in the club.

[eastwoodbear 94]

Just now, LochendBilly said:

Not good eh?

Even a thick git like me knows that. 

[BLUEDIGNITY 33,647]

Be a hard thing to do this unless somebody steps in with real cash,  the financial COVID repercussions haven’t hit properly yet though god help us when they do. It’s a big ask from the punters in this financial climate. 

[Bears r us 30,798]

2 hours ago, wewillfollowrangers said:

Not a member mate, but they dont communicate with their membership, there's zero transparency or accountability and they certainly didn't poll their members on this.

There's definitely potential for a mass fan organisation to funnel funds into the club but club 1872 in its current format is not it.

Thanks, I have had a bad feeling about C1872 right from the start and so far have not changed my mind. I thought when @D'Artagnan joined the board/committee that might change my mind, but when he gave up I realised it was unlikely I would ever join up.

I cannot understand why they would not think communication with their members would be top of the list at any time, but surely this situation would require that even more. 

[STEPPS BOY 73,922]

1 hour ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

It was 100% that way when Green done that IPO. But mind they have had definitely 1, maybe more share sales that haven't been open to the public since we were took off the stock market. I remember that the price of the current shares gor diluted because of it, suggesting that those shares came from the 20% (or was it 25%) of shares that weren't made available in the IPO.  

I know where you're going with this, cause I mind trying to get people to do it when we wanted the board out and that is for all of the individual shareholders like myself and many others on here to join together and become the largest shareholder so we could get rid of the board.

If that is where you're going, we couldn't get the fans to join together back when we REALLY needed it, so I doubt we could do it this time when things a pretty rosy the now.

 

Also, I think it was something like 11/12% shares all the single shareholders combined had. And they were diluted by fuck knows what. 

And with Dave King now selling his shares (who have been buying as many shares as they could since their inception) to Club1872 then they will be far the largest shareholder.  Including adding all the individual shareholders added together. 

Which leaves everyone's best chance of getting a say in how the club is run is signing up for club1872.

Need to hand it to them, they done it. And they done it a lot quicker than I think most people expected them to do.

I would like people who have plenty of cash to still be on the board. From memory, it was the champions league money that was making us just break even (which we never done in craig Shyte first season) putting us into administration faster than I think they were planning on doing. It was always going to happen, remember these guys were con men and would have sold off everything they could first before sticking us in admin. 

Luckily we didn't qualify for the Champions league that season or they would've had a much longer time to see what they could sell before they had to put us in administration. 

Only Charles green knows the exact amount of money he made out of, but I think I could safely say it was well over £40m after it was all split up. Think it was £80m that was raised from the IPO. Not bad, 16x their investment.

 

Parklife.

[The Beast 9,226]

20 hours ago, Real Ranger said:

I don’t really give a fuck if he is or not, I’m not obsessed with him.

Thanks for your input 👍

[The Beast 9,226]

18 hours ago, Bears r us said:

I happened to see this tweet on Twitter and while it does not answer you question it seems some on ff are wondering about something. 

 

Hmmm

I guess when King left the writing was on the wall for the former director.

I'm guessing he doesn't have any dirt on Park or any of the current boardroom.

[Bears r us 30,798]

1 hour ago, eastwoodbear said:

I wouldn't trust them with £13 never mind £13m. 

The lack of communication is worrying 

There hasn't been an AGM since 2018 and I don't know when the last audit took place. 

The first members knew of this deal was in the general posts on the Web. 

The next official contact was an email "Here's the deal, how do you want to pay?" 

I wonder why that would be ??

Surely any organisation who is collecting money from people on a monthly basis should be having a transparent AGM every year. 

I have not paid any attention to them for a while, but reading posts in here the last couple of days has soon reminded me why I never joined in the first place.  

[JCDBigBear 10,825]

9 hours ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

It was 100% that way when Green done that IPO. But mind they have had definitely 1, maybe more share sales that haven't been open to the public since we were took off the stock market. I remember that the price of the current shares gor diluted because of it, suggesting that those shares came from the 20% (or was it 25%) of shares that weren't made available in the IPO.  

I know where you're going with this, cause I mind trying to get people to do it when we wanted the board out and that is for all of the individual shareholders like myself and many others on here to join together and become the largest shareholder so we could get rid of the board.

If that is where you're going, we couldn't get the fans to join together back when we REALLY needed it, so I doubt we could do it this time when things a pretty rosy the now.

 

Also, I think it was something like 11/12% shares all the single shareholders combined had. And they were diluted by fuck knows what. 

And with Dave King now selling his shares (who have been buying as many shares as they could since their inception) to Club1872 then they will be far the largest shareholder.  Including adding all the individual shareholders added together. 

Which leaves everyone's best chance of getting a say in how the club is run is signing up for club1872.

Need to hand it to them, they done it. And they done it a lot quicker than I think most people expected them to do.

I would like people who have plenty of cash to still be on the board. From memory, it was the champions league money that was making us just break even (which we never done in craig Shyte first season) putting us into administration faster than I think they were planning on doing. It was always going to happen, remember these guys were con men and would have sold off everything they could first before sticking us in admin. 

Luckily we didn't qualify for the Champions league that season or they would've had a much longer time to see what they could sell before they had to put us in administration. 

Only Charles green knows the exact amount of money he made out of, but I think I could safely say it was well over £40m after it was all split up. Think it was £80m that was raised from the IPO. Not bad, 16x their investment.

 

The IPO didn't raise anything like that mate..  It was about £22 million.  Green and company certainly made significant money from Rangers but nowhere near the many millions some people think.  

[LookingForEric 133]

I'm guessing that there are Forum readers out there that are also members of C1872. Can I please ask a couple of questions?

Having just listened to the Laura Fawkes interview with Clyde 1 on the previous page (she sounded OK, positive and upbeat) she states that they have been in discussions behind the scenes with 'Dave' for sometime about acquiring his shareholding. She also describes the current activity as a campaign and are hopeful of building on current club positivity to secure the required 20000+ additional Legacy Members necessary to raise over £13m.

Prior to the big announcement via the press, how much did you know about the ongoing discussions and what activity has taken place to drive this campaign and reach out to the wider GLOBAL fanbase?

This isn't intended as a criticism, I personally think to have a 25% fan stake in the Club is a massive coup but I am genuinely interested in how and what they are doing to get the numbers and address any concerns wavering donors may have. It will take more than sitting back in expectation of the masses coming forward.

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

17 hours ago, eastwoodbear said:

I wouldn't trust them with £13 never mind £13m. 

The lack of communication is worrying 

There hasn't been an AGM since 2018 and I don't know when the last audit took place. 

The first members knew of this deal was in the general posts on the Web. 

The next official contact was an email "Here's the deal, how do you want to pay?" 

Fuck, that sounds worrying. Is anyone a member on here?

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

17 hours ago, TMB said:

Yeah, I know it’s not a PLC being traded on the stock market.  I’d rather wait until it was a PLC and buy my own share.  Giving money to Club 1872 so they can speak for me isn’t something I’d be interested in.  But, I do hope they’re successful with this as I’d like to see them get a controlling stake in the club.

Yeah, that was the reason I never joined. They wanted all of your shares a ms soon as you signed up and would act as a proxy. And from what I'm reading since I started posting in this thread (which is just the first 3 or 4 posts then 13pages in) it isn't looking good. 

I posted last night that I was considering joining now, but if what I've read is true, that they just take your shares and never hear from them again then it sounds fishy as fuck. 

I was under the impression that it was 1 member 1 vote (regardless of shareholding) and a rotating directors board. But that name from that sound bite above sounds familiar. Anyone know if she was on the original board of C72's at its inception?

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

15 hours ago, Bears r us said:

I wonder why that would be ??

Surely any organisation who is collecting money from people on a monthly basis should be having a transparent AGM every year. 

I have not paid any attention to them for a while, but reading posts in here the last couple of days has soon reminded me why I never joined in the first place.  

Yeah, it has given me the exact same feeling. Definitely something not right about that. Its all coming back to me now and it was the essential giving away your shares (or rather, your voice) that was the single reason why I never joined.

Plus, that 7500 she mentioned a page back. Was that not the EXACT same membership they had years ago? And by the sounds of it, she's using the Covid-19 thing as a reason why she can't put an exact number on how many members they have now.  

I'd be willing to bet that their numbers are nowhere near 7500 if what folk are saying is true.

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

8 hours ago, JCDBigBear said:

The IPO didn't raise anything like that mate..  It was about £22 million.  Green and company certainly made significant money from Rangers but nowhere near the many millions some people think.  

£22m from fans maybe, think the rest came from the likes of hedge funds etc...

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

2 hours ago, LookingForEric said:

I'm guessing that there are Forum readers out there that are also members of C1872. Can I please ask a couple of questions?

Having just listened to the Laura Fawkes interview with Clyde 1 on the previous page (she sounded OK, positive and upbeat) she states that they have been in discussions behind the scenes with 'Dave' for sometime about acquiring his shareholding. She also describes the current activity as a campaign and are hopeful of building on current club positivity to secure the required 20000+ additional Legacy Members necessary to raise over £13m.

Prior to the big announcement via the press, how much did you know about the ongoing discussions and what activity has taken place to drive this campaign and reach out to the wider GLOBAL fanbase?

This isn't intended as a criticism, I personally think to have a 25% fan stake in the Club is a massive coup but I am genuinely interested in how and what they are doing to get the numbers and address any concerns wavering donors may have. It will take more than sitting back in expectation of the masses coming forward.

Probably better to ask that on FF mate. From memory, I'm fairly certain that there wasn't many on here who joined them when they started. Plus I'm certain that 7500 members is the number that was quoted away back not long after they started. I'm not a member, but I do remember that they were going to try to convince Dave King to sell his shares when he goes. 

I still think the largest group of shareholders are the group I'm in, the ones that aren't part of any group. 

[Bears r us 30,798]

15 minutes ago, Redwhiteandblue said:

Yeah, it has given me the exact same feeling. Definitely something not right about that. Its all coming back to me now and it was the essential giving away your shares (or rather, your voice) that was the single reason why I never joined.

Plus, that 7500 she mentioned a page back. Was that not the EXACT same membership they had years ago? And by the sounds of it, she's using the Covid-19 thing as a reason why she can't put an exact number on how many members they have now.  

I'd be willing to bet that their numbers are nowhere near 7500 if what folk are saying is true.

As I said in that post surely an AGM and full transparency is essential in getting people to sign up to this.

I don't want to sound too negative about C1872 and it is up to each individual to do with their money what they want,  but personally I will need to see big changes in how they run it before I would consider this.

[LookingForEric 133]

1 minute ago, Bears r us said:

As I said in that post surely an AGM and full transparency is essential in getting people to sign up to this.

I don't want to sound too negative about C1872 and it is up to each individual to do with their money what they want,  but personally I will need to see big changes in how they run it before I would consider this.

I think any money put into C1872 is pretty safe, think there are rules etc governing their activity. Only thing is, you are putting your trust in a Board to represent you, you give up your individual right but that is where C1872 will get their strength.

The reason I asked my earlier questions was to ascertain if they are professional and pro active. This is a massive step and opportunity. If they have been working on it behind the scenes for a while, I would expect existing members to be fully engaged and up to speed and equally for their organisation to have plans in place to promote this widely and generate some form of uptake.

All seems a bit hit and miss at the moment as if they expect folk to walk through the door and fall at their feet.

 

[Bears r us 30,798]

13 minutes ago, LookingForEric said:

I think any money put into C1872 is pretty safe, think there are rules etc governing their activity. Only thing is, you are putting your trust in a Board to represent you, you give up your individual right but that is where C1872 will get their strength.

The reason I asked my earlier questions was to ascertain if they are professional and pro active. This is a massive step and opportunity. If they have been working on it behind the scenes for a while, I would expect existing members to be fully engaged and up to speed and equally for their organisation to have plans in place to promote this widely and generate some form of uptake.

All seems a bit hit and miss at the moment as if they expect folk to walk through the door and fall at their feet.

 

I have no info personally to give you but if you read back a page or two it seems no AGM or audit since 2018. Also read that members knew nothing about this until this was announced.

I cannot confirm if that is true or not but the number of people who have resigned from the board in the past few years is also concerning. 

It is up for debate if 25% in fans shares in a group is a good thing or not, but that is another argument, all I am wondering about is if they are running everything as it should be. 

[dougie76 15,359]

Not too fussed about it, whatever happens happens.

[Redwhiteandblue 3,330]

29 minutes ago, Bears r us said:

As I said in that post surely an AGM and full transparency is essential in getting people to sign up to this.

I don't want to sound too negative about C1872 and it is up to each individual to do with their money what they want,  but personally I will need to see big changes in how they run it before I would consider this.

Definitely, if they are not having AGM's, then that is reeking. Definitely something not right with that. 

Why are they not having AGM's and why are they quoting a number (7500) from years back. You would think that a question they could easily answer is "how many members do you have?" 

Very simple question that I would expect everyone on the board to know off the top of their heads. After all, since inception their goal has been fan ownership and they said they were the vehicle that could/would strive to achieve this. 

So you would think that they would know how many fans they need to get that. And it turns out they do, it's an EXTRA 20,000. So why was it so difficult for her to answer such a basic question? 

I doubt I'm the only one who has that gut feeling you get when you know something doesn't add up.. 

[STEPPS BOY 73,922]

Great interview with Dave King on STV.

I have a lot of time for him tbh.