Our defence

[Mclean RFC 1,277]

We need consistency as we have players topping the stats tables in the league all over the place, which is frustrating in itself as we can see now our team isnt shit. Yet we are dropping silly points.

 

glad to see murty isnt happy with the defending and the composure at the back.

[TMB 14,167]

Just now, K.A.I said:

Why's it just the league goals btw?

and we should be a lot closer to celtic, I agree. We've had some bad results under Murty no-one can deny that fact but if yourself or anyone says with a straight face we aren't better off now under Murty than we were under Pedro I'll say their either deluded or a liar.

The OP was speaking exclusively about the league when he mention we have conceded 13 goals more than celtic.  The thread was about us having scored just as many, but we're conceding more, and that's been the difference between the two teams.   You suggested our poor defensive record was due to Pedro and the stats don't support that. 

[rangersross 6,530]

The major problem is at centre back. We're lacking someone with the athleticism or footballing intelligence to stand out there - Weir, Bougherra, Cuellar, etc. - and, as we get closer to mounting a proper title challenge, it'll need to be addressed. Personally, I reckon our defensive weaknesses at full back won't be such an issue once the CB duo's sorted. 

[K.A.I 36,183]

2 minutes ago, THE_MIGHTY_BEARS said:

The OP was speaking exclusively about the league when he mention we have conceded 13 goals more than celtic.  The thread was about us having scored just as many, but we're conceding more, and that's been the difference between the two teams.   You suggested our poor defensive record was due to Pedro and the stats don't support that. 

I was talking about the defence overall though, not specifically the league. 

In all games in all compeitions this season.

Pedro = 16 goals in 14 games.
Murty = 20 goals in 19 games.

It depends on how you want to spin it as we've conceded 3 more but over 5 more games with Murty.

I'm not saying the defence is great, don't get me wrong the point I'm making is that the defence was pish under Pedro. We do look a lot more solid since January when we made signings and Murty got the gig until the end of the season ...

Since January we've conceded x7 goals (literally 3 of them penalties, 1 long ranger and one absolute fuck up by Wes)

That's signs of improvement for me.

 

[hammer93 15,057]

54 minutes ago, Sportingintegritymyarse said:

For me 2nd was worse. Martin had 2 opportunities to sort it. Ridiculously poor clearance then failed to get anywhere near tight enough on Templeton.  A shocker.

Martin was amateurish at the 2nd goal.....he basically stood off and allowed Templeton the space to bend it round him

[bluenoz 30,943]

I've said for ages that out best combination when fit is McCrorie and Alves. I know Bruno has been mediocre but perhaps it has been down to niggling injuries. If he is fit he should play. And McCrorie is a CH.

[SeparateEntityMyArse 53,802]

1 minute ago, hammer93 said:

Martin was amateurish at the 2nd goal.....he basically stood off and allowed Templeton the space to bend it round him

Yep. From his shite clearance too. I thought initially he hadn't had the time to get close to Templeton but he did. He just stood yards off him and gave him the opportunity to do exactly what he did.

[TMB 14,167]

1 minute ago, K.A.I said:

I was talking about the defence overall though, not specifically the league. 

In all games in all compeitions this season.

Pedro = 16 goals in 14 games.
Murty = 20 goals in 19 games.

It depends on how you want to spin it as we've conceded 3 more but over 5 more games with Murty.

I'm not saying the defence is great, don't get me wrong the point I'm making is that the defence was pish under Pedro. We do look a lot more solid since January when we made signings and Murty got the gig until the end of the season ...

Since January we've conceded x7 goals (literally 3 of them penalties, 1 long ranger and one absolute fuck up by Wes)

That's signs of improvement for me.

 

Our shite defensive record has carried on throughout the season and Murty takes his share of blame for that.  Blaming Pedro, who left back in October, seems well wide of the mark to me.  Pedro's not at fault for the 19 league goals we've conceded since he left. 

Our defense needs to be a lot better than it is now.  I'm not sure this guy Martins is any better than Alves TBH.  It's disappointing we've lost Wilson as well.

[K.A.I 36,183]

1 minute ago, THE_MIGHTY_BEARS said:

Our shite defensive record has carried on throughout the season and Murty takes his share of blame for that.  Blaming Pedro, who left back in October, seems well wide of the mark to me.  Pedro's not at fault for the 19 league goals we've conceded since he left. 

Our defense needs to be a lot better than it is now.  I'm not sure this guy Martins is any better than Alves TBH.  It's disappointing we've lost Wilson as well.

I'm not blaming Pedro for anything Murty does ya crackpot. I'm pointing our improvements and some stats to say we are on the right track. 

Martin is no better than Alves. Alves is literally our best defender if he can get fit and settled into the side. 

[Bellshill_Bear 1,105]

I also think wes form has dipped recently.

dont get me wrong he has saved us on numerous occasions due to his excellent 1 on 1s but he doesn’t dive quick enough. Any shot in a corner isn’t almost a goal. Especially to his right. 

Doesnt help when your defence gives the ball away and can’t make a tackle. In the air we have improved but when dealing with players running in they can’t time a decent challenge. Alves is the same but in the air he wins everything.

Defence needs sorted ASAP 

[TMB 14,167]

3 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

I'm not blaming Pedro for anything Murty does ya crackpot. 

GOAT said we've conceded 13 league goals more than celtic and it was costing us.  You were first to respond by blaming that poor defensive record on Pedro.

All I'm saying is that we've conceded 19 league goals under Murty and blaming Pedro for our poor defensive stats in the league is wide of the mark.

[jbm26896 995]

I blame the pitch for our poor defensive display yesterday , we just didn’t look comfortable again , same the last time we played there .

[Ibroxholm 2,280]

I think our main problem is in front of the CB’s and at full back.  We improved significantly when we had McCrorie playing at defensive midfield, giving cover in front our CB’s and filling in for Tav and John when required. Although good going forward both full backs are not great defensively, particularly John.

Bates is our best CB option from a defensive standpoint imo.  We need to find someone to partner him who is comfortable on the ball.  I hoped Cardoso would do that job but he is really weak defensively imo.  Not sure if Alves and Bates would be a good mix together so Bates-Martin looks the best option to go with.

 

[slimjim1690 4,534]

We have two CB's who favour their right feet, a decent left footed CB would help enormously, but preferably two good CB's one right footed and the other left footed.

[Inigo 32,534]

3 hours ago, plumbGER said:

So the new guy and what other 2 are going to be ahead of Bates? who imo has been our best centre half this season.

Martin and Alves.

Yet to be convinced by Bates. Bates has had some good games, but other games where some say he's been good despite having shown some glaring deficiencies during them. 

Alves is made out to be worse than he is generally, Bates to be better than he is, and Martin has been decent until yesterday.

[Inigo 32,534]

Wouldn't be too fussed at losing any of them, right enough. If I thought we could afford and find better then I'd shed no tears over losing the likes of Martin. Ideally I'd want two good quality new centre backs, but I can't see it.

[plumbGER 24,518]

7 minutes ago, Inigo said:

Martin and Alves.

Yet to be convinced by Bates. Bates has had some good games, but other games where some say he's been good despite having shown some glaring deficiencies during them. 

Alves is made out to be worse than he is generally, Bates to be better than he is, and Martin has been decent until yesterday.

All about opinions i suppose, i have yet to be convinced by Alves and his desire to be here, so far he hasn't looked up to the battle (Motherwell game complaining about the physicality) and has shown plenty deficencies himself if players attack him with pace.

Martin i think has been below average and has looked way out of match sharpness, something i would hope would come to him but he was particularly bad yesterday.

I'd agree that Alves isn't as bad as made out btw.

[RDFM 3,809]

Declan John is absolutely garbage.

[thedarvelmarvel 796]

5 hours ago, K.A.I said:

I agree with the full-backs, two worse defenders you'll struggle to find but the defence has a decent record yesterday aside. Goals conceded are penalties or something that's not something they've been at fault for.

I'd love a higher standard of center half in all honesty but they've done alright recently.

i was thinking with 2 attaking backs does that not call for 3 c/bks?

[K.A.I 36,183]

1 minute ago, thedarvelmarvel said:

i was thinking with 2 attaking backs does that not call for 3 c/bks?

Yeah I'm not against that formation, but your then sacrificing the likes of Murphy, Candaies or maybe even Windass to accomodate John and/or Tav - which I'm not willing to do if I'm the manager, unless you've maybe got Murphy as the left wing-back but you could be compromising his attacking qualities in the final third as he may be wanting to defend more depend how the games going.

[McEwan's Lager 30,571]

58 minutes ago, K.A.I said:

Yeah I'm not against that formation, but your then sacrificing the likes of Murphy, Candaies or maybe even Windass to accomodate John and/or Tav - which I'm not willing to do if I'm the manager, unless you've maybe got Murphy as the left wing-back but you could be compromising his attacking qualities in the final third as he may be wanting to defend more depend how the games going.

Yeah agree.

We've clearly signed wingers deliberately with a system in mind so to go play a formation where you are training that way all week with a few guys not involved wouldn't be ideal.

I think Windass would be fine because you could play him in behind two strikers but then you would have to have two defensive midfielders behind him (to play it properly) to compensate for the wing backs and the front three - which rules out Goss, Docherty, Holt and you would have to start with Jack and McCrorie - of which both are injured.

[HG5 11,154]

2 hours ago, RDFM said:

Declan John is absolutely garbage.

Runs well but doesn’t appear to have a clue what to do with it, once he gets there!

[Blueofblood 158]

Isn’t good enough.  Get a left back, right back and a centre half that do what they should and nothing more, defend.  Move John and Tavernier to midfield.  Holding midfielder in (young McCrorie has been superb in there). Will give us better attacking options and more safety at the back.

 

[Dee 27]

When's lee wallace due back

[Wullies_bowly_legs 3,811]

Must admit I was really looking forward to seeing Alves in the team but was disappointed In the main when he did play. However I actually think now the guy has been struggling with injuries both minor and major since he joined so we have not seen him anywhere near his best.

If he has cleared his injuries, gets a partner he has confidence in beside him and with the weather heating up a bit I'm really hopeful he'll start to play to the standard we know he can. I've been watching some of his old club and country performances and he is one seriously hard, tough and skilful player and we can only hope Lego and the Thumb find that out first hand for themselves.

Come on Bruno - time to step up and show us what you can really do.