Tav's time is up.

[King Jela 21,811]

7 minutes ago, Drunk and disorderly. said:

Literally doubling down and moving the goalposts now.

55% is not the VAST majority of anything you care to measure. You keep believing that though if it makes you happy.

 

 

 

 

What an insane post.

You brought up doubling down and then did exactly that. 

The amount of penalties he's scored has been, literally, the overwhelming majority of goal he's scored for us. 

[Iakona 2,326]

Tav will always be Tav. He’s either an 8/10 or a 4/10. 

The issue is that he’s currently the only player in our squad who is capable of rising to the occasion. It’s been years since we had another player who can step up to the mantle and drag us through games. When others fail to show up - Tav has saved their skin… when Tav has a stinker or finds himself on a bad run of form there’s nobody else who’s willing or capable of stepping up. We are so one dimensional.

In reality it’s fucking nuts that we expect so much from a right back… it’s also quite frankly insane that the club have let it get this far. What other team in the modern game has spent the best part of 8 years building their entire team and style of play around a right back!?

We have built a team that allows him to smash personal records… but it’s came at the detriment of the clubs wider success.

I say this as a massive fan of his… it’s time to go. We need a massive culture change at the club. 

[Jimfanciesthedude 25,688]

10 minutes ago, Iakona said:

Tav will always be Tav. He’s either an 8/10 or a 4/10. 

The issue is that he’s currently the only player in our squad who is capable of rising to the occasion. It’s been years since we had another player who can consistently step up to the mantle and drag us through games. When others fail to show up - Tav has saved their skin… when Tav has a stinker or finds himself on a bad run of form there’s nobody else who’s willing or capable of stepping up. We are so one dimensional.

In reality it’s fucking nuts that we expect so much from a right back… it’s also quite frankly insane that the club have let it get this far. What other team in the modern game has spent the best part of 8 years building their entire team and style of play around a right back!?

We have built a team that allows him to smash personal records… but it’s came at the detriment of the clubs wider success.

I say this as a massive fan of his… it’s time to go. We need a massive culture change at the club. 

When was the last time tav "rose" to the occasion

[NeoGeo7 11,348]

1 minute ago, Jimfanciesthedude said:

When was the last time tav "rose" to the occasion

Last one was probably the sheep cup final.

There is no denying he has dug us out of some bad situations in the last but if that’s all he is bringing to the table and it’s happening less often as he doesn’t have the legs anymore for it then it’s time to move on so we can start to share the burden across the team instead of players just hoping he scores a free kick or penalty.

Much like letting Morelos go, we could have kept him on but it’s living off of past successes that is now the problem, likewise for lundstram, goldson, Barisic, jack, roofe

[Iakona 2,326]

24 minutes ago, Jimfanciesthedude said:

When was the last time tav "rose" to the occasion

You would have to be stevie wonder to not see how many times he’s bailed us out over the years.

The point I’m making is when he’s not doing the business, no one else is stepping up to make things happen either. Which is where we currently find ourselves once again… as I said it’s fucking nuts that we are so dependent on a right back. One that’s aging and quite clearly struggling with the amount of games he’s being asked to play. But due how important he has become to our “style” of play and our piss poor recruitment he’s basically been undroppable.

We have reached the point where those who rate Tav and those who don’t rate him finally agree… it’s time to move on.

 

[BlueboyG 5,527]

He scores plenty of goals but concedes plenty too, if we had a decent striker we wouldnt rely on him, im afraid im on the "thanks for everything but time to go" train.

[bluenoz 32,729]

Get back to the basics.

Find a right-back who can defend. Find a right-winger who can score.

[.Williamson. 87,811]

1 hour ago, Jimfanciesthedude said:

When was the last time tav "rose" to the occasion

League cup final and more recently than that he scored a free kick away to Killie in the league to pull us back level in the second half, think Lawrence scored the winner shortly after

[BillyG91 5,595]

.

[King Jela 21,811]

Tav, Goldson and Lundstram have all played their part until a certain point for Rangers. Tav has undoubted bailed us out of trouble. 

The problem is when they reach that certain level and the pressure cranks up. That's when their arse collapses. Every season. 

[left winger 15,712]

18 hours ago, BillyG91 said:

i wasn't sure of him at first but warmed up to him and now again i think aye he's just no good enough for us. done his job for us and i thank him but time to move on.

let's see if clement has what it takes to tell him he's no longer required (assuming he thinks that). don't know what tavernier and some other players have on our managers to convince them they are worth keeping.

What does Tav have on our managers? Really? You can’t work out why Tav has played so many games for us in his time here?

[The Hammer 11 2,879]

1 hour ago, left winger said:

What does Tav have on our managers? Really? You can’t work out why Tav has played so many games for us in his time here?

There's no better option mate, we've dug ourselves into a hole with him, folk bang on about his stats with goals, but it's an embarrasment that a right back at Rangers has achieved those numbers, our forward players should be producing more, instead he's the main goal threat , we've built  a team around him and it's very difficult to undo it 

[.Williamson. 87,811]

2 minutes ago, The Hammer 11 said:

There's no better option mate, we've dug ourselves into a hole with him, folk bang on about his stats with goals, but it's an embarrasment that a right back at Rangers has achieved those numbers, our forward players should be producing more, instead he's the main goal threat , we've built  a team around him and it's very difficult to undo it 

It’s not embarrassing and it’s not very difficult to undo 

[The Hammer 11 2,879]

1 minute ago, .Williamson. said:

It’s not embarrassing and it’s not very difficult to undo 

We haven't managed to undo it using 4 managers, 

[left winger 15,712]

1 minute ago, The Hammer 11 said:

There's no better option mate, we've dug ourselves into a hole with him, folk bang on about his stats with goals, but it's an embarrasment that a right back at Rangers has achieved those numbers, our forward players should be producing more, instead he's the main goal threat , we've built  a team around him and it's very difficult to undo it 

I don’t think we’ve done it on purpose. If you’re a new manager coming into the club, you’ll assess the squad, and despite his defensive shortcomings (which aren’t as bad as are often made out) you’d quickly move past him to worry about other things.

Re forward players and goals - looking purely at stats Sima, Dessers and Danilo  (when fit) aren’t too bad.

Our goalscoring issues, imo, are much more problematic throughout the rest of the team. Our defenders, apart from Tav, don’t score and our midfielders barely score. And apart from a couple from Matondo recently our wingers don’t score either.

It’s quite ironic that two of the players who get the most abuse are our top two goals and assists contributors.

[.Williamson. 87,811]

Just now, The Hammer 11 said:

We haven't managed to undo it using 4 managers, 

What are you looking to undo exactly?

I don’t understand at all how having a high scoring rb is embarrassing, it’s not Tav’s fault we constantly sign shite forwards 

He is currently the clubs captain so teams will always appear to be built around him atm, but to undo that all you have to do is sign a new rb and start phasing Tav out, it’s hardly really difficult as you put it 

Only a couple of weeks ago everyone was pretty together in calling Tav a club legend etc, but now results have dipped we are back to thinking he’s entirely to blame

He has his faults and it’s probably time we look for a replacement but the back and forward of opinion about Tav is ridiculous 

[The Hammer 11 2,879]

1 minute ago, .Williamson. said:

What are you looking to undo exactly?

I don’t understand at all how having a high scoring rb is embarrassing, it’s not Tav’s fault we constantly sign shite forwards 

He is currently the clubs captain so teams will always appear to be built around him atm, but to undo that all you have to do is sign a new rb and start phasing Tav out, it’s hardly really difficult as you put it 

Only a couple of weeks ago everyone was pretty together in calling Tav a club legend etc, but now results have dipped we are back to thinking he’s entirely to blame

He has his faults and it’s probably time we look for a replacement but the back and forward of opinion about Tav is ridiculous 

if it helps mate i was calling for his retirement at the end of the season a few weeks ago, he's been a massive problem for years, shows no leadership and him and goldson often slow down the game to their pace, he needs to go , he's needed to go for about 2 seasons. If it was that easy why didn't we do it after Gio got sacked

[AGM_72 4,098]

1 minute ago, The Hammer 11 said:

if it helps mate i was calling for his retirement at the end of the season a few weeks ago, he's been a massive problem for years, shows no leadership and him and goldson often slow down the game to their pace, he needs to go , he's needed to go for about 2 seasons. If it was that easy why didn't we do it after Gio got sacked

Because the board went for a "safe" appointment who knew the existing squad with the idea that he would get the best out of them/return them to their former levels (see: Kent, Morelos, Kamara).

[.Williamson. 87,811]

5 minutes ago, The Hammer 11 said:

if it helps mate i was calling for his retirement at the end of the season a few weeks ago, he's been a massive problem for years, shows no leadership and him and goldson often slow down the game to their pace, he needs to go , he's needed to go for about 2 seasons. If it was that easy why didn't we do it after Gio got sacked

You were calling for his retirement a few weeks ago when he had just became the top scoring defender in British football? How was that received?

The not showing leadership thing is utter nonsense btw, there’s been countless times Tav has stepped up and either pulled us back into games or been the only one attempting to do so.

There’s at least 2 occasions at celtic park in recent seasons I can think of him trying to single handedly get us something with his goals, there’s the league cup final, there’s recently away to Killie he scored a free kick, there was Dundee United away when we won the title, there were games in Europe on the way to Seville, there have been loads of occasions but people just spout this lie that he never steps up

Not even getting into what Beale did or didn’t do during his time btw 

[Ibroxholm 2,312]

You can argue about Tav not being good enough defensively and his performances dipping significantly from where they were but I’m not having the ‘bottler’ argument.  Time and time again, he has stood up and taken vital penalties for us and pretty well converted them all under the severest of pressure.  He’s no bottler.

Unless a good offer comes in for him over the summer, it would be stupid not to keep Tav (same with Goldson). However, they should be viewed as backup, phasing them out over the next season similar to what we did with Steve Davis.  We know they don’t have that bit extra to get us over the line, we need new blood in there.

[The Hammer 11 2,879]

4 hours ago, .Williamson. said:

You were calling for his retirement a few weeks ago when he had just became the top scoring defender in British football? How was that received?

The not showing leadership thing is utter nonsense btw, there’s been countless times Tav has stepped up and either pulled us back into games or been the only one attempting to do so.

There’s at least 2 occasions at celtic park in recent seasons I can think of him trying to single handedly get us something with his goals, there’s the league cup final, there’s recently away to Killie he scored a free kick, there was Dundee United away when we won the title, there were games in Europe on the way to Seville, there have been loads of occasions but people just spout this lie that he never steps up

Not even getting into what Beale did or didn’t do during his time btw 

There’s 3 major trophies he’s won since we were promoted back to the SPFL , he’s a loser and needs to go 

[graeme_4 37,926]

5 minutes ago, The Hammer 11 said:

There’s 3 major trophies he’s won since we were promoted back to the SPFL , he’s a loser and needs to go 

Sure I saw a stat on Twitter that he’s been directly at fault for 18 goals vs them since he signed.

Always subjective, but there’s at least half a dozen I can think of off the top of my head in recent years. And I’ve blanked out a lot of the Warburton / Murty / Pedro years. 

[The Specky Forum Organiser 69,778]

Need rid of him.

[Community Note FC 8,831]

1 hour ago, Ibroxholm said:

You can argue about Tav not being good enough defensively and his performances dipping significantly from where they were but I’m not having the ‘bottler’ argument.  Time and time again, he has stood up and taken vital penalties for us and pretty well converted them all under the severest of pressure.  He’s no bottler.

Unless a good offer comes in for him over the summer, it would be stupid not to keep Tav (same with Goldson). However, they should be viewed as backup, phasing them out over the next season similar to what we did with Steve Davis.  We know they don’t have that bit extra to get us over the line, we need new blood in there.

I agree. Can question his success, could even argue that at times the only reason we've competed is because of him, but can't question his bottle.

[Bears r us 31,413]

No one can disagree with his goal numbers, they are outstanding, but I remember hoping when Gerrard came in he would name a new captain, that new captain probably needed to be bought in.

Unfortunately he continued with Tav and I think that was a mistake, because the longer he was captain the more difficult it was for a new manager to take it from him.

I believe Phil is waiting until the season is over, before deciding on many players for next season, and that could well include either selling Tav or taking the captains arm band from him.